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From "David Illsley" <>
Subject Re: [AXIS2] Proposal for saving the message context
Date Mon, 18 Dec 2006 09:23:35 GMT
On 17/12/06, Sanjiva Weerawarana <> wrote:
> On Tue, 2006-12-12 at 14:04 -0600, Ann Robinson wrote:
> > This proposal has been available for review and comment since
> > 2006-10-31.
> > I know the shutdown for Axis2 1.1 release took a lot of attention away
> > from
> > other items such as this. However, the prototype for this proposal has
> > been tested and
> > used internally so the prototype has reached a level of stability. I
> > think the risk of
> > introducing problems to the mainstream message processing is very
> > minimal.
> Yes, except it doesn't work as advertised in Axis2 core. It works for
> you for RM because you're not expecting the rest of the context
> hierarchy to come back the way it was when you deserialize.
> I agree the proposal has been around for a long time but I've pointed
> out that its flawed and you're saying "its not flawed for the way I want
> to use it". But if anyone else does mc.serialize() and tries to bring it
> back up it won't work.

I don't buy this argument at all. Anyone who serializes a
MessageContext and expects a fully restored system just by
deserialising it again is IMO living in cloud cuckoo land. That's not
to say someone might not, but that there are any number of bits of
Axis2 that it isn't at all obvious how it works and some additional
investigation, doc reading and questions is required. I don't think
the limitations outlined by Ann are in any way an egregious addition
to those areas, and in addition they're well documented.

I see this very much in the same scope as the clustering proposal -
i.e additional function that is:
1. Complicated
2. Not critical for every Axis2 user
3. Not possible to fully isolate from axis2-kernel
4. Potentially confusing for basic users

I certainly don't believe that the clustering proposal had all the
answers or gave a view of an implementation that I want in Axis2.
However, I think we went the right way in accepting the clustering
proposal despite these problems as we can simplify, hide and factor
out over time.

I believe the same holds for Message Context serialisation. I don't
fully understand all of it right now but I can see the benefit. Lets
work with it on the trunk and over time we can improve our
understanding and most likely some of the code (no offence intended


P.S. I'm actually hopeful that the 2 pieces of work are complimentary
and that by adding both to head and working on them there we'll end up
with a much better kernel.

> > I would really like to get this proposal at a point where it could be
> > included
> > in the Axis2 1.2 release. I am currently working on a solution for the
> > point
> > you made regarding the ServiceContext and I will provide an updated
> > patch.
> Looking forward to it.
> > What are the concerns/issues that are blocking the acceptance of
> > this proposal?
> I'd like to see some others weigh in. Bill, what do you think? I'm sure
> you understand the point I'm making and I'd like to hear whether you
> think its not important. If there are others who feel that its ok to
> commit it then I'll lift my objection; so far its been a conversation
> between Ann and myself and that's not good!
> Glen/Eran/Deepal/Dims/others?
> Sanjiva.
> --
> Sanjiva Weerawarana, Ph.D.
> Founder & Director; Lanka Software Foundation;
> Founder, Chairman & CEO; WSO2, Inc.;
> Director; Open Source Initiative;
> Member; Apache Software Foundation;
> Visiting Lecturer; University of Moratuwa;
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David Illsley - IBM Web Services Development

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