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From "Jongjin Choi" <gunsn...@hotmail.com>
Subject Re: can i help
Date Mon, 16 Aug 2004 12:34:01 GMT
Dear all beehive developers.

I agree with dims's opiniton. We have better to talk about not who(or where) but how.

Ias and I discussed the JSR-181 impl when Ias was in Tmax 
and the rough outline is described in Ias's proposal.

For Beehive WSM APIs and its impl, which is addressed by the proposal (4.b, 4.c, 4.d, 4.e)
there can be the following usage scenario.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Start from Java
 phase(1) .jws --> JSR-181 processor --> java-wsdl mapping (portable / specific)   
 phase(2) .jws + java-wsdl mapping --> WS Platform's tool  --> webservices artifacts(WSDL,
ser/deser, descriptors ...)             
 
In phase (1), 
The JSR-181 processor, which is the implementation of WSM APIs, 
accepts the compiled (or source) jws file and generates a java-wsdl mapping.

The 'java-wsdl mapping' can be portable one (JSR-109/921 jaxrpc-mapping file) 
or target Web Services platform specific one.
Also, it can be a runtime object if the process is performed in JWS container.

In phase (2), 
The target Web service platform's tool accepts java-wsdl mapping and original jws class
and generates web services artifacts (WSDL, serializer, deserializer, xml descriptors and
others)
which can be deployed into the platform.

If the JSR-181 processor can be integrated into WS platform's tool the whole process will
be
integrated seamlessly.

2. Start from WSDL
  phase (1) WSDL -> JSR-181 processor --> .JWS and java-wsdl mapping 
  phase (2) .JWS + java-wsdl mapping + original WSDL --> WS platform's tool 
                            --> webservices artifacdts(WSDL, ser/deser, descritors, ...)


In phase(1), 
The 'start from WSDL' case, the JSR-181 processor accepts WSDL and generates .JWS and java-wsdl
mapping.

In phase(2) is almost same process with 'Start from Java' phase(2).
In this case, the WSDL generated by WS platform's tool should be compared the original WSDL
for checking 
WSDL consistency.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The default Beehive WSM implementation(default JSR-181 processor provided by Beehive project)

should have , I think, two features.

The one will be WS platfrom neutral and its output should be portable format 
- JSR-109 jax-rpc mapping file (for static use for tool) and/or correspoding Java objects
(for dynamic use in container).

The other will be reference implmenetation which uses Axis as its WS platform.
 
I think that  we can (re)use the Apache Axis's WSDL parser and org.apache.axis.wsdl.symbolTable.SymbolTable
and it's related code 
in our implmentation.

The problem for generating JSR-109 jax-rpc-mapping file is for <java-xml-type-mapping>
in jax-rpc mapping, 
which is not covered by JSR-181.
We can apply the rule by JAX-RPC 1.1 and JSR-109 and should consider how to handle the rpc-encoded
cases for this. 
And later, we can consider using the JAXB 2.0's java-to-xml mapping metadata with JSR-181
jws file.

Thanks.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Davanum Srinivas" <davanum@gmail.com>
To: "Beehive Developers" <beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>
Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: can i help


eventually yes...just like axis has wsdl4j.jar etc...

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 08:59:26 +0200, Rasmus Lund <rasmus@it.edu> wrote:
> Wouldn't it be possible to make sure, that the JWS-support is included
> in Axis AND Beehive downloads?
> 
> /Rasmus
> 
> 
> 
> Davanum Srinivas wrote:
> 
> > Heather,
> >
> > As sanjiva mentioned, whoever does the work, gets to make the
> > decisions...we can always move things around later if
> > required/desired. So i'd say it's settled to leave things as-is for
> > now and maybe do a VOTE later if any of the developers want to.
> >
> > thanks,
> > dims
> >
> > On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:27:39 -0700, Heather Stephens <heathers@bea.com> wrote:
> >
> >>We all want it to be the best it can be obviously.  I think the input/conversation
is all good.  :)
> >>
> >>It all depends on how we categorize this philosophically I suppose.  There are
definitely good reasons to have this code in the WS family.  There are also good reasons to
have this code in the Beehive project.
> >>
> >>The main reason IMO to keep this implementation in Beehive is because of the
purpose of Beehive.  It is an integrated metadata-driven framework that leverages the latest
from Sun J2SE 5.0, especially the JSR-175 annotation style.  It provides an easy-to-use programming
model for building webapps.  It targets a user with fewer of the "rockstar J2EE dev" skills,
a user who is more of a business developer and doesn't want to deal with all of the plumbing.
 And Beehive will also be extensible to future subprojects that also leverage JSR-175 style
metadata.  JWS is an important brush stroke on this canvas.
> >>
> >>We do need to flush out the details of the implementation proposal obviously.
 Once we have that in hand should we call a more formal vote or is now the time to settle
it?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Sanjiva Weerawarana [mailto:sanjiva@opensource.lk]
> >>Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 12:17 PM
> >>To: Beehive Developers
> >>Subject: Re: can i help
> >>
> >>Please don't use "JWS" .. that's already used in Axis for Java Web
> >>Services as you may know ...
> >>
> >>I didn't realize this was an RI for a JSR. If so I'm even more confused why
> >>its not a project on its own .. amongst the other various WS projects.
> >>
> >>Oh well - its finally up to the developer community, of course. If you feel
> >>comfortable with the situation then I withdraw my objection.
> >>
> >>Sanjiva.
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: ". Ias" <iasandcb@hotmail.com>
> >>To: <beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>
> >>Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 12:57 AM
> >>Subject: Re: can i help
> >>
> >>
> >>>Here's my understanding and opinion on this issue so far as a creator of
> >>>Axis WSM.
> >>>
> >>>1. Beehive JWS, of which name is from its wiki page although I called it
> >>>Beehive WSM (I agree that JWS is better based on its history), is supposed
> >>>to implement JSR 181 as RI that BEA must provide because they lead the
> >>
> >>spec
> >>
> >>>in JCP.
> >>>
> >>>2. Beehive team has several committers (from BEA and Tmax) including the
> >>>spec lead of JSR 181 and me for the job.
> >>>
> >>>3. As I proposed roughly before, Beehive JWS consists of two layers, a JSR
> >>>181 processor and a possible integration with a web services platform such
> >>>as Axis.
> >>>
> >>>4. As far as I'm concerned, it would be good for Web Services project to
> >>>co-work on JSR 181 with BEA inside Beehive project. The reason is that JSR
> >>>181 belongs to web services technologies, but also is a practical
> >>>application of metadata newly introduced in J2SE 5.0. Beehive requires and
> >>>uses metadata a lot. We can expect help and guidance from Beehive
> >>>developers who are already very familiar with metadata.
> >>>
> >>>5. Regarding the current situation that there's no code for Beehive JWS
> >>>contributed initially by BEA, I propose that JSR 181 API part should be
> >>>checked in as soon as possible to Beehive SVN repository and we should
> >>
> >>keep
> >>
> >>>discussing how we will implement it and integrate it with Axis. I'll make
> >>>my proposal more detailed within a week, and probably talk about it in
> >>
> >>Axis
> >>
> >>>2 Summit as well. In my humble opinion, we all have a nice chance to build
> >>>an open source implementation from the early stage of its targeted spec
> >>>with spec folks and impl folks :-) In other words, the two groups can
> >>>interact productively and progressively to make a JSR 181 implementation
> >>>robust in both technical and pragmatical sense.
> >>>
> >>>Thank you all for your interest in JWS,
> >>>
> >>>Ias
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>From: "Sanjiva Weerawarana" <sanjiva@opensource.lk>
> >>>>Reply-To: "Beehive Developers" <beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>
> >>>>To: "Beehive Developers"
> >>>
> >>><beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>,<dims@apache.org>
> >>>
> >>>>Subject: Re: can i help
> >>>>Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:05:49 +0600
> >>>>
> >>>>+1 .. my personal pref is if the work is directly Web services
> >>>>related it should be done under the WS PMC as much as possible.
> >>>>
> >>>>In addition to the incubation related advantages Dims points
> >>>>out I also think others will discover this work more easily
> >>>>if its in the WS family.
> >>>>
> >>>>Sanjiva.
> >>>>
> >>>>----- Original Message -----
> >>>>From: "Davanum Srinivas" <davanum@gmail.com>
> >>>>To: "Beehive Developers" <beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>
> >>>>Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 8:10 AM
> >>>>Subject: Re: can i help
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Heather,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>My 2 cents, i don't really care where it is done, as long as it gets
> >>>>>done :) We can do this either under the Beehive PMC or WS PMC.
> >>>>>Objective definitely is to get this done quickly and not get stuck
> >>>>>because beehive is still in incubation. Especially since this is
ALL
> >>>>>new code that needs to be written and there is NO existing code
> >>>>>contributed in the incubation phase from BEA, it would make sense
to
> >>>>>do this under WS PMC (so that we can release really quickly w/o
> >>>>>waiting for beehive to get out of incubation). If you all want to
do
> >>>>>that, then let me and sanjiva know...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>thanks,
> >>>>>dims
> >>>>>
> >>>>>On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 17:15:02 -0700, Heather Stephens
> >>
> >><heathers@bea.com>
> >>
> >>>>wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>>Hi Sanjiva.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>The web service part of this project is intended to be an
> >>>
> >>>implementation
> >>>
> >>>>>>of annotation-based programming model for web services (JSR-181).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>See mail threads for latest discussion (and feel free to give
your
> >>>>>>comments!) -->
> >>>>>>
> >>>http://nagoya.apache.org/eyebrowse/ReadMsg?listName=beehive-dev@incubato
> >>>
> >>>>>>r.apache.org&msgNo=145
> >>>>>>and
> >>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>http://nagoya.apache.org/eyebrowse/ReadMsg?listName=beehive-dev@incubato
> >>>
> >>>>>>r.apache.org&msgNo=155
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>JSR-181 info can be found here -->
> >>>
> >>>http://jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=181
> >>>
> >>>>>>Latest thinking on how it might happen within Beehive is found
in
> >>>
> >>>this
> >>>
> >>>>>>proposal from Ias -->
> >>>>>>http://www.apache.org/~ias/beehive-wsm-proposal-draft.txt
> >>>>>>He and others already have prototype code in Axis that we can
use
> >>>
> >>>here.
> >>>
> >>>>>>I hope this helps.
> >>>>>>H.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>From: Sanjiva Weerawarana [mailto:sanjiva@opensource.lk]
> >>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2004 8:20 PM
> >>>>>>To: Beehive Developers
> >>>>>>Subject: Re: can i help
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>If this project is a pure *Web service* project why would we
do it
> >>>>>>as a part of Beehive? I'd rather see it under ws.apache.org
> >>>>>>somewhere. Maybe I misunderstood?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Sanjiva.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>----- Original Message -----
> >>>>>>From: "Mario Morgado" <mmorgado@rogers.com>
> >>>>>>To: "Beehive Developers" <beehive-dev@incubator.apache.org>
> >>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 6:50 AM
> >>>>>>Subject: RE: can i help
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Once I complete reading the documentation on the various
sites,  I
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>will
> >>>>>>provide feedback once i have had some time to put it into context
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Heather Stephens <heathers@bea.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>Hey gang. Mario is interested in helping out with the WS
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>implementation
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>for Beehive.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>The first step is to review the document Ias sent out:
> >>>>>>>http://www.apache.org/~ias/beehive-wsm-proposal-draft.txt
> >>>>>>>(Ias - now that we have a wiki we can go ahead and post this
URL
> >>
> >>to
> >>
> >>>>>>it.)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>And then as the plan takes shape ways you can help would
include:
> >>>>>>>1. Using the implementation done by committers and posting
bugs,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>asking
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>questions or sending on actual fixes to this alias.
> >>>>>>>2. Writing samples or docs.
> >>>>>>>3. Perhaps picking off a feature to implement and submitting
to
> >>>
> >>>this
> >>>
> >>>>>>>alias for acceptance.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Any other ideas anyone?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>From: Mario Morgado [mailto:mmorgado@rogers.com]
> >>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:40 PM
> >>>>>>>To: Heather Stephens
> >>>>>>>Subject: RE: can i help
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Hi Heather I have read the documentation, and would be happy
to
> >>>
> >>>assist
> >>>
> >>>>>>>with the webservice implementation, seems very interesting
having
> >>>
> >>>been
> >>>
> >>>>>>>architecting webservices for the last 2 years now, so I think
I
> >>
> >>may
> >>
> >>>be
> >>>
> >>>>>>>of some use
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I have downloaded SVN, what is next.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>From: Heather Stephens [mailto:heathers@bea.com]
> >>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 12:51 PM
> >>>>>>>To: Mario Morgado
> >>>>>>>Subject: RE: can i help
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Hi Mario. Sorry for the late reply.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>What part of Beehive are you interested in? The part that
will be
> >>>>>>>needing the most work, other than just using Beehive to build
> >>>>>>>pageflows/controls/etc., is the webservice implementation.
I've
> >>>>>>>attached the last email from ias on that subject.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I hope this helps.
> >>>>>>>Heather
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>________________________________________
> >>>>>>>From: Mario Morgado [mailto:mmorgado@rogers.com]
> >>>>>>>Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:27 AM
> >>>>>>>To: Heather Stephens
> >>>>>>>Subject: can i help
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Hi Heather I would really like to help if there is an opportunity
> >>>
> >>>for
> >>>
> >>>>>>me
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>to participate, let me know what I can do, I have downloaded
the
> >>>>>>>source tree.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I am just finishing up another project FPML which started
much the
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>same
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>way as beehive.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Mario Morgado
> >>>>>>>Chief Systems Architect
> >>>>>>>RDM Corporation
> >>>>>>>519-746-8483 X339
> >>>>>>>416-576-2987 Mobile
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Mario Morgado
> >>>>>>>Cheif Architect, Project Manager
> >>>>>>>RDM Corporation
> >>>>>>>519-746-8483 X339
> >>>>>>>416-576-2987 Mobile
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>--
> >>>>>Davanum Srinivas - http://webservices.apache.org/~dims/
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>_________________________________________________________________
> >>>책상위에 다리 올리고 느긋하게 즐긴다... MSN 온라인 상영관
> >>>http://vod.msn.co.kr
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> 
> --
> 
> Rasmus Lund
> Lund & Bendsen ApS
> Naverland 2
> DK-2600 Glostrup
> Denmark
> 
> Phone: (+45) 33 861 861
> Mobile: (+45) 2616 9999
> Private: (+45) 4656 0404
> 
> Mail: rasmus@lundogbendsen.dk
> Web: www.lundogbendsen.dk
> 
> 


-- 
Davanum Srinivas - http://webservices.apache.org/~dims/
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