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From Jean-Baptiste Onofré ...@nanthrax.net>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Subprojects (was [VOTE] Add Cellar into Karaf trunk)
Date Wed, 04 May 2011 09:51:39 GMT
It makes sense to have sub-projects in Karaf:
- WebContainer (using Pax Web)
- EnterpriseContainer (using Aries, OpenJPA)
- OBR (using Felix BundleRepository, home mage stuff)
- Cluster (using Cellar/Hazelcast)

In that case, Karaf itself will be a very lightweight container.

- Karaf itself is more clean and light
- Karaf dependencies are more easy to manage (the dependencies 
management move to subproject)

- multiple projects is not easy to understand for the end-users. See the 
Felix case: I think that a lot of users are lost about Felix, with a lot 
of misunderstanding between Felix Framework and others projects
- it requires more community "interactions": more votes, more releases, etc
- it requires more knowledges for the users to create custom 
distribution with exactly what they want (Karaf is less integrated but 
provide all required to create custom distro)


On 05/04/2011 10:25 AM, Guillaume Nodet wrote:
> @jb If people think Cellar may potentially grow into something bigger,
> we should definitely make it a subproject asap.  It will be much less
> pain than doing that later.
> @achim that could be a good idea.   I remember jb talked about an OBR
> repository and maybe the a webserver (ready to use web container based
> on karaf and pax-web plus all the good stuff you wrote recently) could
> definitely make sense to me.   It may also help keeping the core clean
> and lean.
> On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 09:43, Achim Nierbeck<bcanhome@googlemail.com>  wrote:
>> Hi,
>> +1 for cellar being a subproject.
>> btw. we might need to take a look on different other "core" features
>> that might be considered to be a worthy "subproject".
>> just my 2 cents :-)
>> regards, Achim
>> 2011/5/4 Jean-Baptiste Onofré<jb@nanthrax.net>:
>>> Hi Guillaume,
>>> thanks for the update.
>>> I would prefer to have Cellar directly on Karaf trunk. Like this, it allows
>>> to define Cellar feature into the Karaf features descriptors.
>>> But your remark is right and it could make sense to have Cellar as a Karaf
>>> edge project.
>>> @others: WDYT ?
>>> For the projects dependencies (SMX, CXF, etc), it's just an idea, and I'm
>>> not sure it's a good one :). For now, Cellar is **only** a Karaf cluster
>>> implementation. So it makes sense to be in Karaf. If later, it evolves to
>>> something different, we will think about moving into a new project (as we
>>> made for Karaf, from ServiceMix Kernel, to Felix Karaf and finally Karaf
>>> :)).
>>> Thanks again
>>> Regards
>>> JB
>>> On 05/04/2011 09:32 AM, Guillaume Nodet wrote:
>>>> +0  as I don't plan to work on that code base in the near future
>>>> A few comments though:
>>>>    * I do think it would be better to import cellar into its own
>>>> subproject at http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/karaf/cellar/trunk
>>>>       so that it can have independant releases and won't affect the 3.0
>>>> schedule
>>>>    * if you think of cellar as providing features for servicemix, cxf
>>>> or camel, I think Karaf is not the right place for cellar
>>>>       and I would start in the incubator so that cellar can have the
>>>> broader scope it deserve
>>>> On Tue, May 3, 2011 at 19:41, Jean-Baptiste Onofré<jb@nanthrax.net>
>>>>   wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> following our discussion about Karaf clustering and Cellar, I would like
>>>>> to
>>>>> launch a vote to add Cellar into Karaf trunk.
>>>>> This addition covers the following topics:
>>>>> 1/ Source code
>>>>> Currently, Cellar source code is on github. It will be added into Karaf
>>>>> trunk, on a cellar maven module.
>>>>> All package will be named to org.apache.karaf.cellar and all resources
>>>>> (java, properties, etc) will include Apache header.
>>>>> 2/ Provided features
>>>>> Before inclusion, Ioannis and I would include a new feature which allow
>>>>> you
>>>>> to choose the node discovery mechanism:
>>>>> - static list
>>>>> - unicast
>>>>> - multicast
>>>>> - etc
>>>>> I started to work on it this afternoon, it should be available soon.
>>>>> 3/ Documentation resources
>>>>> The Karaf user and developers manuals will contain Cellar installation
>>>>> and
>>>>> user guide. First step is to complete the Karaf cluster wiki page, and
>>>>> refactore the Ioannis' blog content into user and developers manuals.
>>>>> Depending of the result of the vote, I will raise the corresponding Jira
>>>>> and
>>>>> I will work on it.
>>>>> I have a couple of Karaf Cellar related topics:
>>>>> - I launched a discussion on Apache ACE mailing list. As ACE supports
>>>>> cloud
>>>>> environment (using jclouds), I would like to avoid overlap between ACE
>>>>> and
>>>>> Karaf. The first ACE team feedbacks are good as we consider ACE as a
>>>>> provisioning platform. I will keep you posted about this discussion.
>>>>> the
>>>>> same area (relationship with others Apache projects), I think that we
>>>>> have
>>>>> to discuss with Camel, ServiceMix, CXF, ActiveMQ, and others about we
>>>>> improve Karaf Cellar to provide services for these projects.
>>>>> - I submitted a talk for the next ApacheCon 2011 (Vancouver, 5th-11th
>>>>> November) about Karaf in an enterprise environment. It will include Karaf
>>>>> 3.0.0 new features presentation and of course Karaf Cellar introduction.
>>>>> I
>>>>> also plan to make a demo using Karaf, Cellar, and ACE to show how Karaf
>>>>> is a
>>>>> powerful OSGi runtime/container in an high value enterprise environment.
>>>>> Regarding these topics, I submit the addition of Cellar into Karaf to
>>>>> your
>>>>> vote:
>>>>> [ ] +1 Approve the addition of Cellar into Karaf trunk
>>>>> [ ] -1 Veto the addition (please provide specific comments)
>>>>> This vote will be open for 72 hours.
>>>>> I'm available if you need deeper explanations about Cellar.
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> JB
>> --
>> --
>> *Achim Nierbeck*
>> Apache Karaf<http://karaf.apache.org/>  Committer&  PMC
>> OPS4J Pax Web<http://wiki.ops4j.org/display/paxweb/Pax+Web/>
>> Committer&  Project Lead

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