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From Jean-Baptiste Onofré ...@nanthrax.net>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Subprojects (was [VOTE] Add Cellar into Karaf trunk)
Date Wed, 04 May 2011 09:51:39 GMT
It makes sense to have sub-projects in Karaf:
- WebContainer (using Pax Web)
- EnterpriseContainer (using Aries, OpenJPA)
- OBR (using Felix BundleRepository, home mage stuff)
- Cluster (using Cellar/Hazelcast)

In that case, Karaf itself will be a very lightweight container.

Pro:
- Karaf itself is more clean and light
- Karaf dependencies are more easy to manage (the dependencies 
management move to subproject)

Cons:
- multiple projects is not easy to understand for the end-users. See the 
Felix case: I think that a lot of users are lost about Felix, with a lot 
of misunderstanding between Felix Framework and others projects
- it requires more community "interactions": more votes, more releases, etc
- it requires more knowledges for the users to create custom 
distribution with exactly what they want (Karaf is less integrated but 
provide all required to create custom distro)

Regards
JB

On 05/04/2011 10:25 AM, Guillaume Nodet wrote:
> @jb If people think Cellar may potentially grow into something bigger,
> we should definitely make it a subproject asap.  It will be much less
> pain than doing that later.
>
> @achim that could be a good idea.   I remember jb talked about an OBR
> repository and maybe the a webserver (ready to use web container based
> on karaf and pax-web plus all the good stuff you wrote recently) could
> definitely make sense to me.   It may also help keeping the core clean
> and lean.
>
> On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 09:43, Achim Nierbeck<bcanhome@googlemail.com>  wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> +1 for cellar being a subproject.
>>
>> btw. we might need to take a look on different other "core" features
>> that might be considered to be a worthy "subproject".
>> just my 2 cents :-)
>>
>> regards, Achim
>>
>> 2011/5/4 Jean-Baptiste Onofré<jb@nanthrax.net>:
>>> Hi Guillaume,
>>>
>>> thanks for the update.
>>>
>>> I would prefer to have Cellar directly on Karaf trunk. Like this, it allows
>>> to define Cellar feature into the Karaf features descriptors.
>>> But your remark is right and it could make sense to have Cellar as a Karaf
>>> edge project.
>>> @others: WDYT ?
>>>
>>> For the projects dependencies (SMX, CXF, etc), it's just an idea, and I'm
>>> not sure it's a good one :). For now, Cellar is **only** a Karaf cluster
>>> implementation. So it makes sense to be in Karaf. If later, it evolves to
>>> something different, we will think about moving into a new project (as we
>>> made for Karaf, from ServiceMix Kernel, to Felix Karaf and finally Karaf
>>> :)).
>>>
>>> Thanks again
>>> Regards
>>> JB
>>>
>>> On 05/04/2011 09:32 AM, Guillaume Nodet wrote:
>>>>
>>>> +0  as I don't plan to work on that code base in the near future
>>>>
>>>> A few comments though:
>>>>    * I do think it would be better to import cellar into its own
>>>> subproject at http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/karaf/cellar/trunk
>>>>       so that it can have independant releases and won't affect the 3.0
>>>> schedule
>>>>    * if you think of cellar as providing features for servicemix, cxf
>>>> or camel, I think Karaf is not the right place for cellar
>>>>       and I would start in the incubator so that cellar can have the
>>>> broader scope it deserve
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, May 3, 2011 at 19:41, Jean-Baptiste Onofré<jb@nanthrax.net>
>>>>   wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> following our discussion about Karaf clustering and Cellar, I would like
>>>>> to
>>>>> launch a vote to add Cellar into Karaf trunk.
>>>>>
>>>>> This addition covers the following topics:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1/ Source code
>>>>> Currently, Cellar source code is on github. It will be added into Karaf
>>>>> trunk, on a cellar maven module.
>>>>> All package will be named to org.apache.karaf.cellar and all resources
>>>>> (java, properties, etc) will include Apache header.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2/ Provided features
>>>>> Before inclusion, Ioannis and I would include a new feature which allow
>>>>> you
>>>>> to choose the node discovery mechanism:
>>>>> - static list
>>>>> - unicast
>>>>> - multicast
>>>>> - etc
>>>>> I started to work on it this afternoon, it should be available soon.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3/ Documentation resources
>>>>> The Karaf user and developers manuals will contain Cellar installation
>>>>> and
>>>>> user guide. First step is to complete the Karaf cluster wiki page, and
>>>>> refactore the Ioannis' blog content into user and developers manuals.
>>>>>
>>>>> Depending of the result of the vote, I will raise the corresponding Jira
>>>>> and
>>>>> I will work on it.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a couple of Karaf Cellar related topics:
>>>>> - I launched a discussion on Apache ACE mailing list. As ACE supports
>>>>> cloud
>>>>> environment (using jclouds), I would like to avoid overlap between ACE
>>>>> and
>>>>> Karaf. The first ACE team feedbacks are good as we consider ACE as a
pure
>>>>> provisioning platform. I will keep you posted about this discussion.
On
>>>>> the
>>>>> same area (relationship with others Apache projects), I think that we
>>>>> have
>>>>> to discuss with Camel, ServiceMix, CXF, ActiveMQ, and others about we
can
>>>>> improve Karaf Cellar to provide services for these projects.
>>>>> - I submitted a talk for the next ApacheCon 2011 (Vancouver, 5th-11th
>>>>> November) about Karaf in an enterprise environment. It will include Karaf
>>>>> 3.0.0 new features presentation and of course Karaf Cellar introduction.
>>>>> I
>>>>> also plan to make a demo using Karaf, Cellar, and ACE to show how Karaf
>>>>> is a
>>>>> powerful OSGi runtime/container in an high value enterprise environment.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regarding these topics, I submit the addition of Cellar into Karaf to
>>>>> your
>>>>> vote:
>>>>>
>>>>> [ ] +1 Approve the addition of Cellar into Karaf trunk
>>>>> [ ] -1 Veto the addition (please provide specific comments)
>>>>>
>>>>> This vote will be open for 72 hours.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm available if you need deeper explanations about Cellar.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> JB
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> *Achim Nierbeck*
>>
>>
>> Apache Karaf<http://karaf.apache.org/>  Committer&  PMC
>> OPS4J Pax Web<http://wiki.ops4j.org/display/paxweb/Pax+Web/>
>> Committer&  Project Lead
>>
>
>
>

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