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From Dominik Psenner <dpsen...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [Discuss][VOTE] Combine the project user and dev mailing lists into user@ and dev@
Date Fri, 10 Mar 2017 10:23:02 GMT
We had once the discussion that we wanted all Apache Logging projects to 
become very similar in their usage, starting with the same or a very 
similar configuration. Given that we should aim towards one Apache 
Logging specification and several Apache Logging specification 
implementations in the form of Apache Logging subprojects. That means 
all the devs for all subprojects have to talk more. To me this is a good 
reasons to merge the dev mailing lists. Further I don't see why the same 
use case should not apply to the user mailing lists, too. Those mailing 
lists see very low traffic but all of them need a larger audience. Just 
quoting the last few messages of two user mailing lists I follow:

log4j-user: the last topic came in a week ago, the topic before that 
about two weeks ago
log4net-user: the last topic came in 24 hours ago and the topic before 
that a month ago

Cheers

On 2017-03-09 19:24, Ralph Goers wrote:
> We use general as mainly an announcement list for topics that might be 
> of general interest to all logging projects. Generally, these are just 
> release announcements.
>
> Ralph
>
>> On Mar 9, 2017, at 10:37 AM, Matt Sicker <boards@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:boards@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Yeah, I agree that the user lists can remain separate as it doesn't 
>> cause any issues currently. The main idea here is whether we should 
>> merge the dev lists into one, or if we need a common dev list for all 
>> devs to subscribe to (general@ doesn't sound appropriate, but I don't 
>> know what that list is for).
>>
>> On 9 March 2017 at 10:26, Ralph Goers <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com 
>> <mailto:ralph.goers@dslextreme.com>> wrote:
>>
>>     You should note that while we consider all votes only PMC votes
>>     are “binding”. I don’t think that changes much however.
>>
>>     From a PMC perspective I have to say that keeping the user’s
>>     lists separate isn’t likely to be an issue as most of the things
>>     that would need to be discussed would be on a dev list anyway.
>>
>>     Ralph
>>
>>>     On Mar 9, 2017, at 2:45 AM, Dominik Psenner <dpsenner@gmail.com
>>>     <mailto:dpsenner@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     The votes are way too scattered over the different mailing lists
>>>     so that I didn't even find my own vote. ;-) Therefore I'm trying
>>>     to summarize the current state of the vote:
>>>
>>>     log4j-dev@, log4php-dev@, log4net-dev@, log4cxx-dev@ ->dev@logging.apache.org
<mailto:dev@logging.apache.org>
>>>
>>>     Matt Sicker: +1
>>>     Ralph Goers: +1
>>>     Stefan Bodewig: +1
>>>     Sven Rautenverg: -1
>>>     Thorsten Schöning: -0
>>>     Ivan Habunek: -0
>>>     Dominik Psenner: +1
>>>     Remko Popma: +1
>>>     Mikael Ståldal: +0
>>>
>>>     Totals so far:
>>>     +1: 5
>>>     +0: 1
>>>     -0: 2
>>>     -1: 1
>>>
>>>     log4j-user@, log4php-user@, log4net-user@, log4cxx-user@, general@ ->user@logging.apache.org
<mailto:user@logging.apache.org>
>>>
>>>     Matt Sicker: -1
>>>     Ralph Goers: +1
>>>     Stefan Bodewig: -1
>>>     Sven Rautenverg: -1
>>>     Thorsten Schöning: -0
>>>     Ivan Habunek: -0
>>>     Dominik Psenner: +1
>>>     Remko Popma: +1
>>>     Mikael Ståldal: -1
>>>
>>>     Totals so far:
>>>     +1: 3
>>>     +0: 0
>>>     -0: 2
>>>     -1: 4
>>>     Sorry to anyone who's vote is missing.
>>>
>>>     On 2017-03-08 05:20, Matt Sicker wrote:
>>>>     I may be missing some mailing lists considering I just
>>>>     subscribed to half of them less than five minutes ago.
>>>>
>>>>     This is a vote to merge the various Apache Logging Services
>>>>     mailing lists. The proposal is to combine them as follows:
>>>>
>>>>     log4j-dev@, log4php-dev@, log4net-dev@, log4cxx-dev@ ->
>>>>     dev@logging.apache.org <mailto:dev@logging.apache.org>
>>>>     log4j-user@, log4php-user@, log4net-user@, log4cxx-user@,
>>>>     general@ -> user@logging.apache.org
>>>>     <mailto:user@logging.apache.org>
>>>>
>>>>     commits@ and private@ remain the same as before.
>>>>
>>>>     The proposal would also suggest that the old emails become
>>>>     aliases for the combined email names so as not to lose any
>>>>     future emails. To distinguish between projects, a subject tag
>>>>     can be added such as:
>>>>
>>>>     [java]
>>>>     [net]
>>>>     [cxx]
>>>>     [php]
>>>>
>>>>     Though I wouldn't think such a tag is required, though it
>>>>     should help in gaining the attention of the appropriate audience.
>>>>
>>>>     Voting:
>>>>
>>>>     +1: Yes, combine the mailing lists!
>>>>     +0: Go ahead, don't care that much.
>>>>     -0: Don't like it, but not vetoing it.
>>>>     -1: No, don't do that! I have a better idea!
>>>>
>>>>     This vote follows the same "lazy consensus" (at least 3 +1
>>>>     binding, no -1/vetoes) we use for general releases and whatnot.
>>>>     The vote will be open for at least 72 hours.
>>>>
>>>>     -- 
>>>>     Matt Sicker <boards@gmail.com <mailto:boards@gmail.com>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Matt Sicker <boards@gmail.com <mailto:boards@gmail.com>>
>


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