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From Tim Casey <tca...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Question about best way to architect a Solr application with many data sources
Date Wed, 22 Feb 2017 20:01:31 GMT
I would possibly extend this a bit futher.  There is the source, then the
'normalized' version of the data, then the indexed version.
Sometimes you realize you miss something in the normalized view and you
have to go back to the actual source.

This will be as likely as there are number of sources for data.   I would
expect the "DB" version of the data would be the normalized view.
It is also possible, the DB holds the raw bytes of the source which are
then transformed and into a normalized view.  Indexing always happens from
the normalized view.  In this scheme, frequently there is a way to mark
what failed normalization so you can go back and recapture the data for a
re-index.

Also, if you are dealing with timely data, being able to reindex helps
removing stale information from the search index.  In the pipeline of
captured source -> normalized -> analyzed -> information, where analyzed is
indexed here, what you do with the data over a year or more becomes part of
the thinking.



On Tue, Feb 21, 2017 at 8:24 PM, Walter Underwood <wunder@wunderwood.org>
wrote:

> Reindexing is exactly why you want the Single Source of Truth to be in a
> repository outside of Solr.
>
> For our slowly-changing data sets, we have an intermediate JSONL batch.
> That is created from the source repositories and saved in Amazon S3. Then
> we load it into Solr nightly. That allows us to reload whenever we need to,
> like loading prod data in test or moving search to a different Amazon
> region.
>
> wunder
> Walter Underwood
> wunder@wunderwood.org
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
>
>
> > On Feb 21, 2017, at 7:34 PM, Erick Erickson <erickerickson@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Dave:
> >
> > Oh, I agree that a DB is a perfectly valid place to store the data and
> > you're absolutely right that it allows better interaction than flat
> > files; you can ask questions of an RDBMS that you can't easily ask the
> > disk ;). Storing to disk is an alternative if you're unwilling to deal
> > with a DB is all.
> >
> > But the main point is you'll change your schema sometime and have to
> > re-index. Having the data you're indexing stored locally in whatever
> > form will allow much faster turn-around rather than re-crawling. Of
> > course it'll result in out of date data so you'll have to refresh
> > somehow sometime.
> >
> > Erick
> >
> > On Tue, Feb 21, 2017 at 6:07 PM, Dave <hastings.recursive@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> Ha I think I went to one of your training seminars in NYC maybe 4 years
> ago Eric. I'm going to have to respectfully disagree about the rdbms.  It's
> such a well know data format that you could hire a high school programmer
> to help with the db end if you knew how to flatten it to solr. Besides it's
> easy to visualize and interact with the data before it goes to solr. A
> Json/Nosql format would work just as well, but I really think a database
> has its place in a scenario like this
> >>
> >>> On Feb 21, 2017, at 8:20 PM, Erick Erickson <erickerickson@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I'll add that I _guarantee_ you'll want to re-index the data as you
> >>> change your schema
> >>> and the like. You'll be able to do that much more quickly if the data
> >>> is stored locally somehow.
> >>>
> >>> A RDBMS is not necessary however. You could simply store the data on
> >>> disk in some format
> >>> you could re-read and send to Solr.
> >>>
> >>> Best,
> >>> Erick
> >>>
> >>>> On Tue, Feb 21, 2017 at 5:17 PM, Dave <hastings.recursive@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>> B is a better option long term. Solr is meant for retrieving flat
> data, fast, not hierarchical. That's what a database is for and trust me
> you would rather have a real database on the end point.  Each tool has a
> purpose, solr can never replace a relational database, and a relational
> database could not replace solr. Start with the slow model (database) for
> control/display and enhance with the fast model (solr) for retrieval/search
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> On Feb 21, 2017, at 7:57 PM, Robert Hume <rhume55@gmail.com>
wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To learn how to properly use Solr, I'm building a little experimental
> >>>>> project with it to search for used car listings.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Car listings appear on a variety of different places ... central
> places
> >>>>> Craigslist and also many many individual Used Car dealership
> websites.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I am wondering, should I:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (a) deploy a Solr search engine and build individual indexers for
> every
> >>>>> type of web site I want to find listings on?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> or
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (b) build my own database to store car listings, and then build
> services
> >>>>> that scrape data from different sites and feed entries into the
> database;
> >>>>> then point my Solr search to my database, one simple source of
> listings?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> My concerns are:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With (a) ... I have to be smart enough to understand all those
> different
> >>>>> data sources and remove/update listings when they change; while
this
> be
> >>>>> harder to do with custom Solr indexers than writing something from
> scratch?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With (b) ... I'm maintaining a huge database of all my listings
> which seems
> >>>>> redundant; google doesn't make a *copy* of everything on the
> internet, it
> >>>>> just knows it's there.  Is maintaining my own database a bad design?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for reading!
>
>

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