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From "Marcus (OOo)" <>
Subject Re: Website Content plus Look and Feel Improvements
Date Thu, 07 Jul 2011 12:12:02 GMT
Am 07/07/2011 11:25 AM, schrieb Graham Lauder:
> On Wed, 2011-07-06 at 08:34 -0700, Kay Schenk wrote:
>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2011 at 12:39 AM, Graham Lauder<>wrote:
>>>> We had some earlier discussions on this.  Personally, I was proposing
>>>> that we take the opportunity to simplify.  For example, right now
>>>> we're doing all the work on ooo-dev.  At some point it will be clear,
>>>> perhaps soon, that we need an ooo-user list.
>> > From my POV, what would be really helpful right now to the existing user
>> base, is to somehow migrate over the "Announcement" list and its
>> corresponding subscribers.  And, have someone designated to be the
>> "announcement guru". My feat at the moment is losing supporters/users who
>> don't have any interest in direct contribution but who use
> We have to be careful about rushing before we have an established
> community that is needed to run a users list.  At present we have had a
> reasonably large migration to LibreOffice but I consider them to still
> be part of our greater community.  In terms of brand recognition our
> brand still has high profile because LO is still seen as a "fork" of
> OOo.  Possibly not the best scenario for the LO people but until they
> break fresh marketing ground that's simply the reality.  What this gives
> us is breathing space that we would not have but for LO's existence, not
> a lot it is true but enough.  OOo will not disappear from the LO users
> ken for a number of months, possibly even a year.
> In the interim before a release, an active announce list and marketing
> blog should be priorities as well as maintaining a profile on User
> forums such as
>> And maybe a few others.
>>>> But I'd resist the urge to recreate the byzantine complexity of OOo
>>>> until we're sure that we need it.  I'm hoping we never do.
>>> Small projects do have the advantage that people can contribute as suits
>>> their availability and feel their contribution is meaningful.  That's
>>> just a function of Human group dynamics, we can get to know about 8
>>> people well, 25 we can work with, once the numbers get up however then
>>> people are simply in the company of strangers and thus they feel
>>> unrecognised and unappreciated.
>>>>> The home page as it is now was designed originally with one overriding
>>>>> goal: "increase downloads."
>>>> Do you think this should still be the overriding goal of the homepage?
>>> There was reasoning behind this, more downloads = more users, More Users
>>> = Greater market share, More market share = more contributors. However
>>> the homepage grew from that original precept to become "Make it as easy
>>> as possible for someone landing on the homepage to have their OOo needs
>>> fulfilled!"  Downloads was one of those needs.
>>> There was a history to the "More Downloads" thing, in 06 I think it was,
>>> Sun decided to spend some money on promoting OOo.  Rather than giving it
>>> to the marketing project and letting us use it as best we could, they
>>> spent it with a promotions company to use on internet marketing (and
>>> gave the Marketing team a part of it, with the proviso that it be spent
>>> on promo materials, but that's another story.)  The promo company spent
>>> around 35K USD, IMS, on google keywords and the like on a "Pay on click
>>> through" basis. Clicking on a text ad or keyword sent people to
>>>  The money disappeared fast, so there were lots
>>> of clickthroughs.
>> Oh boy...interesting little known facts.
> It was frustrating, we could have run a community driven campaign that
> raised brand recognition (always our single biggest problem) and we
> would have steered them to the page, build confidence in the
> brand and then led them to the download button, but someone in the
> corporate space somehow figured that dumping people straight onto the
> download page would turn into downloads, if only it was that easy.
>>>   However, the rate of download changed not even so
>>> much as decimal of a percent.  The promo company picked up their check
>>> and the value to the project was zero.  To me and number of other people
>>> in the marketing project, the reason was obvious.  The redesign of the
>>> homepage was a response to that failure, so that if ever they were that
>>> generous again we could say: "Just link to homepage
>>> because we have proved that it increases downloads."
>> Why wouldn't you design a homepage for "users" that makes it easier for them
>> to get what they need -- monetary contributions notwithstanding?
>> is first and foremost a "client" product.
> The confusion with the original design was the confusion over the
> definition of "User". Our problem is that our User-Base is diverse in
> terms of Internet sophistication.  The homepage in it's effort to cater
> for this huge diversity ended becoming too complex and confusing, a
> problem I foresee if we try to simplify everything too much. A maillist
> for devs is not the best place to have marketing discussions or users
> complaining that their download "doesn't work", or artists considering
> the aesthetics of different fontsets.
>>>>> So, keep the home page as is or find someway to get the CMS to display
>>>>> it, action statements intact at least.
>> yes...I hope to investigate the Apache CMS capabilities in this regard this
>> week.
> I'm still in the committer pending box, as soon as that is actioned I'll
> get to grips with the CMS as well.  The initial homepage will be
> probably more informational than guiding people to downloads.  We could
> probably go with familiarity and substitute the download button for a
> "Countdown to Release" perhaps and link it to a blog, what do you think?

I know the bits behind the download website as I helped to keep it 
running and have made some improvements. To install a countdown button 
to show how many days until release is a good idea.

It should be clickable to link to a blog, announcement, release 
schedule, whatever we will define.

I always liked the one from Fedora. However, currently there is none.

To get an idea here are some older ones:

> Play a bit of the MS vaporware game.  Trickling press releases,
> tantalising blog entries and so on!  :)  A bit difficult on public lists

Normally I would leave them alone in their self-created game. ;-)
But yes, for the initial release we need to push the news and press guys 
to our project.

> it's true (which is why we had some private lists in the marketing
> project) but it's all about keeping the attention simmering.

I also think that mailing lists are not the best medium to "speak" with 
marketing and news people outside. A single and easy to reach webpage is 
much better.


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