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From Shane Curcuru <>
Subject Re: [Proposal] Shutting down legacy OOo mailing lists
Date Wed, 19 Oct 2011 20:18:07 GMT
Two important comments:

On 10/19/2011 4:11 PM, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
> On 17/10/2011 Rob Weir wrote:

> And (this is a vital detail) we should give a message of continuity, not
> of disruption. We (in this context, i.e., Italian end-users mailing
> lists) shouldn't communicate in a way that implies that the old
> is dead and that a new is born, since the
> product our users will be talking about in the mailing lists is still
> the "old", and the fact that the new home is at Apache is
> not a fundamental difference to them; they will continue using the
> product and taking care, when the time comes, of localization and QA; we
> would scare users and contributors away by describing an "old/dead"
> I would turn the post you describe into a warning that the mailing list
> address will change, including all information about Apache but not
> requiring users to take action. I volunteer to consolidate the 12 lists
> into 3 and to subscribe users to the right ones (of course, being
> "project owner" of, I have a list of all subscribers
> to the 12 lists).

I agree that the message should be positive, and that it's a change of 
mailing list name, but it will still be used to help support users.

Note that I disagree with having three lists; I would far prefer to 
start with a single list per NL.  We've found in most projects that 
having fewer lists encourages a stronger community.

In any case, details of which lists are which can be worked out in the 
wiki page listing the mappings, I'd hope.

> One can find flaws in this process since, from a technical point of
> view, we are mass-subscribing users; but remember that this is just a
> migration. I read your remarks in other threads, but we don't risk to
> help spammers this way (there is no spam on the 12 lists I monitor) and
> it would be a suicidal move for to shut down mailing
> lists and leave the majority of users in a position where they can say
> " is dead, to the point that even the peer-support mailing
> lists have been shut down".

Actually, I'm pretty sure we will not be mass-subscribing users.  That 
is generally regarded as a very bad idea in Apache projects, and given 
EU privacy laws I'm not even sure we should be auto-subscribing people 
to new lists.  Rob noted, instead, that we'd make it easy for users on a 
specific list to click a link to subscribe to the new, equivalent list.

>> 7) After two weeks we request via Oracle that the Kenai admins close
>> the lists, per:
> I would change this into a one-month period in which the old addresses
> still work but just as forwarders to the new (remapped) lists, followed
> by a silent closure of the old addresses.

I like the idea of the transfer period being a month instead of two 
weeks, if we believe the existing servers will last that long.  Many 
users may not check these lists that often.  But that's just my suggestion.

- Shane

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