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From Joe Schaefer <>
Subject Re: Java download link on AOO site
Date Thu, 12 Jul 2012 21:48:39 GMT
Hello? Is this thing on?  This project has a whopping
9GB website that all of maybe 5 people on the planet
know how to takecare of, and it is rife with stale
information inherited from a different past.  The website
is a *community* resource and that means *everyone* is
responsible for its upkeep.  You should be working hard
to ensure that *everyone* is capable of fixing it, not
making exceptions for certain committers just because
they do special things for you in other areas.  Anyone
can use the CMS to submit a patch, and had Hagar done
at least that much I wouldn't have anything to gripe about.

The technology that facilitates website maintenance happens
to be a CMS, but really it is no more challenging to work with
than the average wiki.  Get over it, it's not a technological
barrier for anyone capable of using a web browser, that means
Hagar is part of the intended user base, despite his attitude
towards it.

----- Original Message -----
> From: Andrea Pescetti <>
> To:
> Cc: 
> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2012 5:30 PM
> Subject: Re: Java download link on AOO site
> Hagar Delest wrote:
>>  Le jeu. 12 juil. 2012 21:19:50 CEST, Joe Schaefer
>>  a écrit :
>>>  Hagar is a committer, that comes both with certain rights and certain
>>>  responsibilities, the latter of which is to not bother others with work
>>>  he can carry out effectively himself.
>>  Don't tell me that since I'm a committer I've to comply with 
> all the
>>  package that goes with it. Why doesn't Apache adapt to a project that 
> is
>>  rather new for it, doing with a large user base and side areas like
>>  forums, NL teams, ...?
> More than an "Apache way vs OpenOffice tradition" fight, this is about 
> the role of volunteers. I find it perfectly acceptable that a volunteer chooses 
> certain areas due to personal inclinations and neglects other non-vital areas: 
> volunteering is supposed to be fun in the end. Likely, most committers have (or 
> can reach) the technical knowledge to fix bugs, but this would be highly 
> ineffective for most of them, and "Please learn C++ and fix it 
> yourself" has been regarded so far, and should still be regarded, as 
> offensive towards someone who is just reporting a bug or doing QA.
>>  So let's me say that I'm now really fed up with your lessons.
>>  So do what you want, I don't care. But forget about new blog posts from 
> me.
> I hope this eventually is forgotten and Hagar's contributions can continue 
> as usual, but I'd say this is a natural outcome of this conversation. What 
> else could come out of it? And do we really need this kind of discussions? The 
> PPMC votes committers in because of merit, and it's very rare that a 
> candidate's merits span all over the project: most times one can do a very 
> relevant contribution by helping in the one area of the project he likes most 
> (be it user support on the forums, or on the mailing lists, or localization, or 
> programming...).
> Regards,
>   Andrea.

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