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From Andre Fischer <awf....@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Pre-release IRC+video informal meeting?
Date Mon, 31 Mar 2014 08:40:53 GMT
On 29.03.2014 12:14, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
> On 27/03/2014 J├╝rgen Schmidt wrote:
>> On 3/27/14 1:59 AM, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
>>> Is there interest for a "live" (meaning: IRC + video, like Google
>>> Hangouts or similar) meeting to make sure that we (developers, QA,
>>> Localization, Documentation, website...) are all on the same page
>>> regarding the upcoming 4.1 release?
>> we can try such a meeting but I don't see the benefit compared to a
>> clear communication on the mailing list (can be of course improved).
>
> The benefit would be: make sure that active volunteers have a chance 
> to be heard and to influence the release. We are doing good now; 
> still, we can do better. See below for concrete examples.
>
>> Either we do it in a more organized way and define exactly what we
>> expect or I am not interested.
>
> I am not interested in the other option. Well, maybe I misunderstood 
> what you mean by "organized", but for sure I would find it overkill 
> that we have to vote for someone to be in a call to represent a 
> certain group (say, QA) and vote on what the call topics should be. 
> It's an informal meeting.
>
>>> It wouldn't be a meeting where things are decided (we have the lists 
>>> for
>>> that!), but merely a meeting where people can inform each other to make
>>> sure that all priorities are being addressed ...
>> I am in favor of having such discussion mainly on the list to have it
>> documented.
>
> Note that it's more about being informed (about stuff that is already 
> somewhere on the lists), and discussion can follow on lists.
>
> Maybe it helps if I make a concrete past example: the "Restore 
> windows" problem https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=119006 
> has been known for two years. It only triggered on certain versions of 
> Mac OS X and only after a crash. Still it caused 500+ e-mails, and 
> probably countless forum posts and some enraged/lost users. In 
> retrospect, we should have evaluated it better.
>
> How can we avoid the next "Restore windows", i.e., something that is 
> known, important to someone, already documented somewhere but that 
> would deserve better attention? It's important for OpenOffice as a 
> project that active volunteers feel that they can influence the 
> release. And it is also very good for OpenOffice as a product.
>
> Now, the obvious answer is "Just place it in Bugzilla and nominate it 
> as a release blocker". This doesn't always work. For a release 
> blocker, for example, you would require in most cases that a patch is 
> available, and a description that is purely technical can miss to 
> state why it is important to get it fixed before release. And if you 
> look at who is nominating blockers, you'll see that only a few people 
> do that.
>
> The IRC+video meeting is the best solution I can find, but anything 
> else that guarantees proper escalation would work for me. Just, asking 
> people to simply follow the process is too demanding on volunteers and 
> we need to streamline it (another concrete example? we don't have 4.0 
> in Danish mainly due to bad communication, since translation was 
> completed before the 4.0 release but after the deadlines).
>
> If you want yet another example... we already know that OpenOffice 4.1 
> is going to have display problems for Gnome 3 users on Linux. Two bugs 
> have clearly been identified: no refresh on fields 
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=124482 and no scrollbars 
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=121627 ; the former has 
> a working patch by Andre and I'll nominate it as a blocker, but what 
> about the latter? Does it make sense to nominate it even if we don't 
> have a fix available? Will a meeting where active people can report on 
> what they see on the forums, lists etc help in making the assessment?
>

These are valid examples that have to be addressed.  Why not on the 
mailing list?  I don't object to video conference or IRC but personally 
I prefer communication by mail.   It allows me to take the time to think 
about what others say and about may reply.  It also gives me time for 
technical analysis of the bugs.

-Andre


> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
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