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From Roberto Galoppini <roberto.galopp...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Date Fri, 04 Sep 2015 20:05:11 GMT
2015-09-04 19:39 GMT+02:00 Louis Suárez-Potts <luispo@gmail.com>:

> Comments inline; Roberto, feel free…
>
>
> > On 04 Sep 15, at 13:10, Dennis E. Hamilton <orcmid@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > It is not clear to me what is being discussed here.  Can we separate out
> the parts, please?
> >
> > 1. There is discussion of sending someone to participate in the ODF
> Plugfest to be held on 2015-09/15-16, 11 days from now.  That includes a
> request for travel funding.
>
> Yes. Honestly, tho this could be an important event, the rush and cost are
> such that unless someone is closer to the event—i.e., not on the wrong side
> of the Atlantic—the cost would seem prohibitive, especially if my presence
> would only be to relay status.
>
> >
> > 2. It is not clear to me exactly what that participation would be.
>
> Quite.
>
> >  Is it only to participate in status and not testing?
>
> If I were to go, that would in fact be the case: status not testing.
> However, there is also the point that I’ve been trying to make (and I think
> Roberto, too) about the optics—the appearance—of our presence or
> nonpresence.
>
> >  If it is status, it appears that any status presentation is likely part
> of an agenda item to be led by Gijs Hillenius of OSOR.
>
> Yes.
>
> > See <
> http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info>.
> The topic is "ODF in the market place."  That is an interesting topic if it
> remains the focus.  I'm not certain what we know about in that respect.  I
> definitely think it would be useful to have concrete information about that
> specific topic with respect to Apache OpenOffice.  If we figured it out, we
> could offer a slide or two without having to be there.  Would that suffice?
>
> Yes, but given the malleability of things, I’d guess that we could shape
> the topic to a degree. By concrete information, I am guessing you have in
> mind data we can cite indicating uptake or usage of AOO and thus of our
> implementation of ODF. To this point, Rob did point out that we could re-do
> our survey, which looked at preferred open source office suites. One could
> also conceivably add more questions illuminating AOO’s market currency.
> (Eg, percentage in any sector or other useful data points that suggest a
> picture of how and where AOO is being used. We did this a long while ago,
> at the Oasis ODF Adoption TC.)
> >
> > 3. I don't understand what English flyer from the OpenDocs Society is
> being spoken of.  I don't recall the ASF and certainly not the AOO Project
> being participants/sponsors of the OpenDocs Society.  Am I mistaken?  Is a
> draft available?
>
> You are not mistaken as far as I know regarding sponsorship. I think a
> draft is available and was sent by Basil, but….
> I think the money here, which we have some discretionary control over,
> independent of ASF—perhaps Andrea can explain it better—would go for
> printing. But: this, too is coming thick and fast. I mean the call for
> action on this matter.
>
> >
> > 4. Also on this thread, there is some question about payment.  If this
> is with regard to sponsoring this event, or being a sponsor in the
> production of a flyer, the timing is very short here and it seems to me
> that the window may have closed.
> >
> > Also, please note that today is the early-start beginning of a major
> 3-day Holiday weekend in the United States.  We must move deliberately but
> inclusively.
> >
> > Please clarify,
>
> Doubtless Roberto or Andrea can shed more light.  I had been aware of the
> event but had not planned on going before, as it interacted (and still
> does) with a prior personal engagement. But the event does strike me as
> potential important. But not so important as to cause the sky to fall,
> should we not make it.
>
> The status report Gijs would read out is good. But my point that being
> there and meeting the government developers and representatives, as well as
> the others involved, would send a strong signal to an admittedly small but
> probably significant group.
>
> But Roberto, who went last time, and Rob, who’s gone many times, can
> probably evaluate the scenario better than I. And we can also meet the
> principals elsewhere. Like at ACEU. Indeed, inviting them to the event and
> then holding much more informed and less rushed meetings there, would be
> good; but it would depend on them being there.
>

Actually I didn't go since the Orvieto Plugfest, that is almost 10 years
ago. Anyway, I believe we missed the opportunity to come up with something
valuable and interesting for the agenda, unless someone has a different
idea. If I would have gone I would have joined the technical sessions, but
again our understanding of how AOO is or is not compliant with the finally
approved ODF 1.2 is little at best.

To all this we should add the concerns and questions rightfully raised by
Dennis, here and on the other thread.

I would favor us to get a hold of where are we in respect of such a
standard, and plan to join the next Plugfest.

My two cents.

Roberto


>
> best
> louis
>
>
>
> >
> > - Dennis
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:luispo@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 07:27
> > To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> >
> >
> > Status, then, is:
> >
> > * We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created.
> Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it
> may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
> >
> > * We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at
> the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly
> imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
> >
> > * Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot
> of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to
> have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s
> bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
> >
> > - Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the
> Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also
> encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there
> may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I
> was with large corporations.)
> >
> > Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced
> its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental
> entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards
> ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations
> and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF
> plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or
> attending.
> >
> > Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the
> would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead,
> dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
> >
> >
> > I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would
> hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
> >
> > But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first
> that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not
> come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
> >
> > Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer,
> then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants
> to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is
> willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
> >
> > Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and
> cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has
> voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
> >
> > -louis
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