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From Marcus <marcus.m...@wtnet.de>
Subject Re: [proposal] going Agile
Date Sat, 10 Feb 2018 12:26:13 GMT
Am 10.02.2018 um 06:21 schrieb Peter Kovacs:
> Migration would be done by infra. They wrote up everything need to know:
> 
> https://wiki.apache.org/general/ApacheBugzillaToJiraMigration

I find it cumbersome that all our users should then use Jira to open a 
bug report.

What about to keep Bugzilla for the development work? Damjan has made a 
very valuable point here (rough quote: BZ issues are linked in SVN, 
code, webpages, even Confluence.And nobody wants to migrate this stuff - ).

But then we can use Jira to organize our project work. If you want you 
can then also use the Agile Board functions.

> Again, it is not about the tool it is about the workflow. I would like 
> to have a Kanbanboard, to get transparency what is worked on, who can I 
> approach if I have a volunteer to work together. New Volunteers need 
> someone they can follow.
> 
> I want to have a Backlog to define what is important to do next, and to 
> fill the detailed steps together what we need to do. Maybe we could 
> together fill out so much detail, that it is easy for everyone to start 
> on the topic.
> 
> 
> That is the original proposal. I know that Jira is _the_ industry tool 
> to this. Every major professional major Project uses Jira. It would not 
> be so popular if it would not have a certain quality.

Yes, but we are not "industry" and also not "professional". Did you know 
that it is closed source and you need to pay for to be able to use it? 
;-) Luckily the ASF got a license free of charge.

> I know that you complained onec there are so many differnt links to note 
> and tools that we have in our arsenal.

I don't complain. I just want to express my opinion why not everything 
you've proposed is fitting for us.

> Jira could be reduce the lot. Thats why I think it is convenient.
> 
> 
> BTW. If we start using Kanban, I will reach out to the one Volunteer who 
> volunteered and loves Kanban if want to have a try with us, we are now 
> following his way (more or less...) Maybe he jumps at it.

And that's the point: maybe. We simple don't know if we get more 
volunteers (that will also stay).

Thats the nature of volunteers. They will look if they like what they 
see and are gone when they are no longer committed. It's great when we 
get feedback what should be changed, so that they show a higher 
commitment or simply stay longer.

> We had another Volunteer who said: tell me what to do I do it. But I do 
> not have the interest to figure it out on my own. We can currently not 
> use these people. With Backlog and Board we can.

Sure, these people can help us to go further. With our without a 
graphical based board. Sure, it's easier with it.

Of course we can change some workflows. But I doubt that it would bring 
us more volunteers when we turn everything inside out.

Therefore let me summarize:

- Use BZ for the development work (e.g, fixing a specific bug).
- Work in Jira for the project tasks and technical coordination (e.g.,
   Windows signing).
- Use Confluence for project work and as documentation base.
- Take the Agile Board functions in Jira if it fits for us.
- Also we can see what we need to do to claim "We are working along
   Kanban rules".

PS:
I just wantot repeat a sentence from above:

I'm not totally pro or contra your proposal. I just want to express my 
opinion why not everything you've proposed is fitting for us.

Marcus



> On 09.02.2018 23:05, Marcus wrote:
>>> I would prefer to avoid the upheaval of switching to a different 
>>> issue tracker if at all possible.
>>
>> +1
>>
>> Jira is just another tool that wouldn't bring us any nearer to closed 
>> issues. BTW, start new? Then you would trash all old issues which 
>> isn't a good thing. Move them over to Jira? Great, who is the 
>> volunteer to do the migration? ;-)
>>
>> But Confluence can bring us some overview. We can structure similar BZ 
>> issues to packages and then we can work on them. 


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