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From Aivaras Stepukonis <astepuko...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Language Variables as Constants...
Date Tue, 03 Sep 2013 19:50:18 GMT
I see your point, although it is a bit different than the issue I am 
raising. By a "variable" I simply meant a linguistic description of a 
menu item (command) which may have to vary in its grammatical form when 
that item occurs in several locations and/or contexts of the same UI. 
Proper translation of such a description would require some form of 
acknowledgment that multiple occurrences of the same command may require 
multiple descriptions.

Granted it would multiply strings and the bulk of translation would 
increase, but...that is very little in comparison to the outrageous 
amount of time a translator has to spent on putting together the bits 
and pieces spread around opengrok, po's, localize.sdf, ui, etc. When I 
look at the allocation of my energy and time as a translator in this 
project, translation is almost last thing I'm doing...

So...

Let's have ten times more words, if needed, and let have in-place 
translation, and we'll be 50 if not 100% ahead of where we are right now.

Aivaras


2013.09.03 22:25, Ricardo Berlasso rašė:
> 2013/9/3 Aivaras Stepukonis <astepukonis@gmail.com>
>
>> That is exactly my point - ethnocentrism. One determines that a certain
>> term is a grammatical constant in his/her language and needs not being
>> repeated. But that is just his/her language and his/her situation. Only
>> after surveying a reasonable pool of experiences in other languages can one
>> make a more general (communal) conclusion that helping oneself is also
>> helping others.
>>
> While I completely understand your concern (I started a related thread(1)
> some time ago about gender and variables) there is a big technical problem
> here: if, for instance, the variable is used on an environment with several
> "cases" (for example, the variable is accompanied by a verb that needs to
> be declined on several genre and number cases), by eliminating the variable
> and setting a new string for each case the work for the translators will be
> heavily increased.
>
> That said, maybe there are practical solutions to this kind of problems (I
> do not have the technical background to even start thinking of them), but
> for sure those solutions will not be easy to implement. I would love to see
> this kind of problems solved, but IMO a lot of research is needed first.
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>
> (1) http://markmail.org/message/elhcwveyk4fh4i7w
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> Aivaras
>>
>> 2013.09.03 18:28, janI rašė:
>>
>>   On 3 September 2013 16:33, Aivaras Stepukonis <astepukonis@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>   It is quite disheartening to find out that some menu item
>>>> titles/descriptors are used in several locations as one and the same
>>>> string
>>>> assuming that the linguistic expression in those locations can remain
>>>> unchanged (constant). Unfortunate, this is an English-centric assumption.
>>>>
>>>> What has a constant linguistic form in English (thus allowing its
>>>> repetition across the UI without the need to adapt) may actually have a
>>>> variable linguistic form in another language (in my case, it's
>>>> Lithuanian).
>>>> Repeating such strings in the UI puts a local translator in a very
>>>> uncomfortable position because what looks correct in one place may turn
>>>> out
>>>> to have an incorrect grammatical form in another.
>>>>
>>>> I've given an example of this in an earlier e-mail.
>>>>
>>>>   I agree with you, but I have heard others complaining about, why they
>>> had
>>> to translate the same word multiple times, e.g. you will find the string
>>> "Cancel" more the 30 times.
>>>
>>> rgds
>>> jan I.
>>>
>>>   Aivaras
>>>>
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