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From Greg Brown <gkbr...@mac.com>
Subject Re: SWT APIs on top of Pivot for Web based tools
Date Sat, 10 Apr 2010 11:59:27 GMT
OK, I get it. It is definitely an interesting idea. Not sure I could personally get 100% behind
it, though. Pivot isn't just a widget toolkit - it is also an application development framework
(conceptually similar to the combination of SWT and JFace). The approach you describe would
effectively bury Pivot at the bottom of the stack, which would marginalize (if not completely
obscure) the other valuable APIs.

On the other hand, it would be cool to see Eclipse running as a Pivot app.  :-)

On Apr 9, 2010, at 4:59 PM, Steve Reiner wrote:

> 1. Eclipse e4 with XWT xml, XWT binding, and CSS styling is getting closer
> to Pivot, so Pivot for regular desktop eclipse plug-ins is getting less
> compelling.  http://wiki.eclipse.org/E4/XWT  
> 2. However, with SWT control apis on top of Pivot controls, leveraging
> existing java/rcp/jface/draw2d/gef/plugin code in the browser would be a
> killer use-case/app/feature! 
> 3. Eclipse e4 has some subproject about adding JavaScript apis for calling
> eclipse apis. I like Pivot's approach better where Pivot can be scripted in
> any jvm language: JavaScript, Groovy (like best), and Scala, etc. 
> 4. Maybe there are things in Pivot that could improve XWT and get closer to
> the Flex programming model. I have just started looking at XWT and Pivot,
> one thing saw was  <wtkx:script> that I didn't see in XWT. Looks like XWT
> might add something for JavaScript scripting
> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=266772
> 5. Saw mention from Feb 22 on this list about creating a "SWT Plugin" for
> browsers. Basically with SWT control apis on top of a SWT implementation
> done with Pivot/Java2D, you would have a "SWT Plugin" (i.e. the standard
> Java plugin) without needing another plugin.
> 6. How the swtswing project dealt with SWT's event loop may help
> Pivot/swt thread in this list from Feb 22 for reference 
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/pivot-dev/201002.mbox/%3c85D2286A-8
> C22-4D12-A031-D7E84A4EF576@mac.com%3e
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/pivot-dev/201002.mbox/%3c4CCDA974-F
> E19-4AB6-A212-82A85B753018@mac.com%3e
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/pivot-dev/201002.mbox/%3c6723c42710
> 02221325w75ae12cevf2bbdf4ea7640fe0@mail.gmail.com%3e
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Brown [mailto:gkbrown@mac.com] 
> Sent: Friday, April 09, 2010 5:22 AM
> To: dev@pivot.apache.org
> Subject: Re: SWT APIs on top of Pivot for Web based tools
> Hi Steve,
>> It would be great if there was an implementation of SWT control APIs on
> top
>> of Apache Pivot.
>> This would enable developers to leverage the large body of existing
>> Java/SWT/RCP/JFace/Draw2D/GEF/EclipsePlugin code. 
> This is an interesting idea. There would certainly be some implementation
> challenges (e.g. how to deal with SWT's event loop, since Pivot doesn't have
> one - it uses AWT's under the hood). Definitely worth some further thought
> and discussion, though.
>> Developers could create web based versions of their tools (from the same
>> code base as their desktop versions). They wouldn't have to rewrite Java
>> into Flex/ActionScript, JavaFx, Silverlight, Ajax/Html/Javascript.
>> Developers would be free to choose how to partition their java code
> between
>> the applet portion and the app server portion.
> From our perspective, this is actually one of the major selling points of
> Pivot in general - it allows you to streamline your technology stack and use
> Java from top to bottom (similar to what Microsoft offers with
> Silverlight/.NET). I recognize that this doesn't meet the immediate use case
> you describe (allowing developers to re-use existing SWT/RCP code), but
> let's look at it from the reverse perspective - if we were to port Pivot to
> run natively on SWT, you could write your RCP app or plugin using Pivot's
> APIs and ultimately reap the same benefits you describe above.
> Greg

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