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From Daniel Kulp <daniel.k...@iona.com>
Subject Re: Can we release an M1 with a dependency on a MINA-Snapshot version???
Date Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:12:46 GMT

From my standpoint, I will vote -1 (non-binding) on the general@incubator 
list (as well as here) for a release with a SNAPSHOT of an Apache 

Allowed by the license or not, I don't think the ASF should do anything to 
promote having unofficial versions of ASF artifacts being distributed 
around under the guise of another "release".   I think that puts the ASF 
in a bad possition.   The ASF release processes are there to protect the 
ASF.   This basically circumvents it.

If JPMC or RedHat or IONA or someone wants to create a release with that 
snapshot, sure.   The license will definitely let them.   But from an ASF 
standpoint, I don't think WE want to do it.

I would say release with the non-snapshot version (all the tests do pass), 
but stick the "SNAPSHOT" up on the wiki/web page with a huge disclaimer 
with it that says something like "this fixes problems XYZ, but this is an 
unofficial snapshot that is not an official ASF release.   It may cause 
other issues. blah blah blah"   Even better would be to point to the MINA 
website if they have a nightly snapshot or something available.   Help 
drive some traffic there.

I suppose all that legal stuff could go in the NOTICES file, but I'm still 
very uncomfortable with it from an ASF standpoint.  (caveat being I'm not 
an ASF member, but we still need look out for it as an ASF project)


On Thursday November 16 2006 12:06 pm, John O'Hara wrote:
> That's what we need -- some mentor time!
> We can use any code (a license is a license is a license).
> The question is whether the Incubator PMC will allow it to become M1?
> Cliff, James, Paul - any opinion?
> In a nutshell: we have a "fix" for MINA that Qpid depends on, but has
> not yet been adopted by a released MINA version.
> We want to "Release early and often" becuase the user base is building
> and they'd like some more fixed targets....
> Can Qpid still release an M1?
> John
> On 16/11/06, Steve Vinoski <vinoski@iona.com> wrote:
> > On Nov 16, 2006, at 11:26 AM, John O'Hara wrote:
> > > On 15/11/06, Steve Vinoski <vinoski@iona.com> wrote:
> > >> Yes, it can be long. But those are the rules by which we must
> > >> abide under Apache. As Rajith points out in a separate email, it's
> > >> not even clear that M1 as it stands can get out the door given its
> > >> dependency on an unreleased version of mina.
> > >>
> > >> I don't make the rules. I just want to live by them, as I'm sure
> > >> we all do, and I know that maven will help greatly in that regard.
> > >
> > > With Apache licensed software, we can use any checked in code that
> > > bears the
> > > license.
> >
> > Chapter and verse, please. We've had a number of people over the past
> > few days assert what the "real" rules are, and now you've just added
> > another. These assertions have greatly differed. If I were the M1
> > release manager, I would want to see an official Apache document that
> > clearly states what's possible in this regard.
> >
> > I am surprised that our mentors haven't chimed in yet.
> >
> > --steve

J. Daniel Kulp
Principal Engineer
P: 781-902-8727    C: 508-380-7194   F:781-902-8001

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