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From "Mattmann, Chris A (398J)" <chris.a.mattm...@jpl.nasa.gov>
Subject Re: Mailing list transition (was Re: Apache Spark podling: Created!)
Date Sat, 29 Jun 2013 02:42:49 GMT
Hey Matei,

Yep the below is exactly what I suggested to Andy (per your plan below).

And yep I think with the $p.i.a.o namespace the transition is pretty
seamless and doesn't require much from the users.

Cheers,
Chris

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++






-----Original Message-----
From: Matei Zaharia <matei@berkeley.edu>
Date: Friday, June 28, 2013 5:29 PM
To: <dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>
Cc: Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>,
"spark-developers@googlegroups.com" <spark-developers@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Mailing list transition (was Re: Apache Spark podling:
Created!)

>Hey Chris,
>
>I definitely understand that we need to move to Apache lists, and I think
>that's fine, but maybe one question -- is it possible to transform the
>*@spark.incubator.apache.org <http://spark.incubator.apache.org/> lists
>into *@spark.apache.org <http://spark.apache.org/> more seamlessly when
>we graduate? It's weird to ask users to move twice. If these could
>somehow become aliases that would be ideal.
>
>In any case though, I think we'll have a gradual transition. I'd first
>move the dev list over, then the user one, and for a while I'd keep both
>and keep a notice on the Google group. I'm not sure how Google groups
>allow that but there must be a way.
>
>Matei
>
>On Jun 28, 2013, at 4:40 PM, "Mattmann, Chris A (398J)"
><chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
>
>Hey Reynold,
>
>I hear your pain - trust me I do - but at the same time it doesn't
>make sense to half complete bringing the community over. Mailing list
>conversation (especially user oriented ones) are one of the core
>portions of open source communities at least in my experience.
>
>There are not really many hard requirements here at the ASF -- there
>are social norms and memes and old fuddy duddies like me who share
>those memes and information with people to try and encourage open
>source best practice, while at the same time trying not to disturb
>all the awesomeness going on that you guys are leading.
>
>With that, how many users are we talking about on the user mailing
>list at this point? Can you give me an exact count?
>
>I'm willing to spend the time to get people migrated now. Then,
>migrating later from user@spark.incubator.apache.org to
>user@spark.apache.org
>will be really less of a hassle and a lot less difficult since we
>are really moving from ezmlm to ezmlm. Also with the $podling.i.a.o
>namespace I think even now we can use spark.apache.org (*think*)
>which in turn could cause even less hassle later. In addition, like
>I said, when we graduate to TLP I'll also be happy to contribute
>time towards making the migration as seamless as possible.
>
>Cheers,
>Chris
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Reynold Xin <reynoldx@gmail.com>
>Reply-To: "dev@spark.incubator.apache.org"
><dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>
>Date: Friday, June 28, 2013 4:08 PM
>To: "dev@spark.incubator.apache.org" <dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>
>Cc: Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>,
>"spark-developers@googlegroups.com" <spark-developers@googlegroups.com>
>Subject: Re: Mailing list transition (was Re: Apache Spark podling:
>Created!)
>
>Hi Chris,
>
>There are a lot of user preferences set by them (e.g. individual emails vs
>batch) that wouldn't work when you just "import". If user list is not an
>absolute requirement for the incubator, it would make sense to delay
>the migration of user lists until we are graduating to a TLP.
>
>
>On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 4:02 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J) <
>chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
>Hi Andy et al.,
>
>Why don't we just collect the current subscribers to the Google Group,
>get them to me, and I'll subscribe them to the ASF new lists? I'm happy
>to create a user list here at the ASF for the project, and to migrate
>the users. Then all they would have to do is remember to use the new
>email when addressing. A change, yes, I know, but still a minimal one.
>
>That OK?
>
>Cheers,
>Chris
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>
>Date: Friday, June 28, 2013 2:04 PM
>To: jpluser <chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
>Cc: "dev@spark.incubator.apache.org" <dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>,
>"spark-developers@googlegroups.com" <spark-developers@googlegroups.com>
>Subject: Re: Mailing list transition (was Re: Apache Spark podling:
>Created!)
>
>+ spark-developers@googlegroups.com to loop in those who haven't
>subscribed to dev@spark.i.a.o yet, (also because my emails are getting
>bounced by Apache's spam filters).
>
>I wanted to respond here in the conversation about the mailing list
>migration that was happening on the email thread called "Re: A wiki for
>Spark (on Apache infra)"...
>
>Assuming that we Apache requires us to migrate from google groups to
>lists on Apache infra, we might consider waiting to migrating the users
>list to apache infra until after we graduate to a TLP, so that we only
>have to migrate it once.
>
>
>Here's why. I assume with each list migration that requires subscribers
>to do work, we will lose some subscribers. If we ask them to migrate to
>an incubator user list now and then again to yet a different list when
>
>
>we
>graduate to a TLP (which we hope to
>do fairly quickly), it seems like we will irritate and lose strictly
>more subscribers.
>
>
>This requirement to migrate infra twice as part of moving to Apache
>
>
>seems
>a bit hard on communities. It also seems like a requirement that will
>
>
>go
>away if the changes you are pushing for to the incubation process (i.e.
>podling TLPs) actually ever happen.
>
>
>Anyway, I see our options as:
>
>
>1. Migrate only the dev list now (since this is a smaller core group
>
>
>that
>is more likely to migrate with us) and wait to create an apache users
>list until we graduate and migrate from the users google group then.
>
>
>Con:
>it's confusing to have user and dev
>lists on different infra.
>
>2. Move the users list now, in which case we go with the migration
>
>
>plan I
>proposed earlier. Con: migrating users list twice = more irritating to
>users.
>
>Andy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 12:20 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J)
><chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
>Hi Andy,
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
>From: Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>
>Reply-To: "dev@spark.incubator.apache.org"
><dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>
>Date: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 10:18 AM
>To: "dev@spark.incubator.apache.org" <dev@spark.incubator.apache.org>
>Subject: Re: Apache Spark podling: Created!
>
>This is great.
>
>Quick question about mailing lists: Spark also has a
>spark-users<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/spark-users>
>google
>group. Can we also get a users@spark.i.a.o mailing list to have
>
>
>
>
>somewhere
>to migrate that group? Do I need to create an infra issue for this?
>
>
>
>OK, cool yeah I think I requested commits and dev as lists earlier, but
>didn't request a user one. To request a new list, you go here:
>
>https://infra.apache.org/officers/mlreq/incubator
>
>
>Did you request a list yet? Should i?
>
>(BTW sorry about the delay in responding was at a DARPA meeting all
>week
>in
>DC an am just back in California now catching up on everything).
>
>
>
>Also, we should discuss a strategy, and timeline for migrating the
>mailing
>lists over to the new ones.
>
>As far as a strategy, here are the steps I can think of that will help
>make
>for a smooth transition:
>
>  1. Request users list on apache infra (done)
>  2. Pick a day/time for the switch (how about July 1, assuming
>  users@spark.i.a.o is set up by then)
>  3. At Switch time:
>     1. Make announcements on the dev and users mailing lists with
>
>
>
>
>links
>     to the new lists, instructions on how to subscribe, and a note
>saying all
>     conversations are moving over to that list.
>     2. Update the website with links to the new lists
>     3. Enable an auto responders on those lists with pointers to the
>new
>     apache lists
>
>
>
>Perfect! That's correct Andy.
>
>Cheers,
>Chris
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
>
>
>
>On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 5:03 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J) <
>chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
>CC'ing dev@spark.i.a.o: our first email to the dev list! :)
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Henry Saputra <henry.saputra@gmail.com>
>Date: Friday, June 21, 2013 4:51 PM
>To: jpluser <chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
>Cc: Matt Massie <massie@cs.berkeley.edu>, Reynold Xin
><rxin@cs.berkeley.edu>, Matei Zaharia <matei@apache.org>, Ankur Dave
><ankurdave@gmail.com>, Tathagata Das <tdas@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
>
>
>
>
>Haoyuan
>Li
><haoyuan@cs.berkeley.edu>, Josh Rosen <joshrosen@cs.berkeley.edu>,
>Shivaram Venkataraman <shivaram@eecs.berkeley.edu>, Mosharaf
>
>
>Chowdhury
><mosharaf@cs.berkeley.edu>, Charles Reiss
>
>
><charles@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
>Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>, Patrick Wendell
><pwendell@eecs.berkeley.edu>, Imran Rashid <imran@quantifind.com>,
>
>
>Ryan
>LeCompte <lecompte@gmail.com>, Ravi Pandya
><ravip@exchange.microsoft.com>,
>Ram Sriharsha <harshars@yahoo-inc.com>, Robert Evans
><evans@yahoo-inc.com>, Mridul Muralidharan <mridulm@yahoo-inc.com>,
>Thomas
>Dudziak <tomdz@clearstorydata.com>, Mark Hamstra
><mark@clearstorydata.com>, Stephen Haberman
><stephen.haberman@gmail.com>,
>Jason Dai <jason.dai@intel.com>, Shane Huang
>
>
><shannie.huang@gmail.com
>,
>Andrew xia <xiajunluan@gmail.com>, Nick Pentreath
><nick.pentreath@gmail.com>, Sean McNamara
><sean.mcnamara@webtrends.com>,
>"Ramirez, Paul M (398J)" <paul.m.ramirez@jpl.nasa.gov>, Roman
>Shaposhnik
><rvs@apache.org>, Suresh Marru <smarru@apache.org>, "Hart, Andrew F
>(398J)" <Andrew.F.Hart@jpl.nasa.gov>
>Subject: Re: Apache Spark podling: Created!
>
>Thanks for driving this forward Chris, awesome as usual! =)
>
>
>The mailing lists are ready:
>dev@spark.incubator.apache.org
>commits@spark.incubator.apache.org
>
>private@spark.incubator.apache.org
>
>
>
>You can subscribe by sending email to:
>dev-subscribe@spark.incubator.apache.org
>commits-subscribe@spark.incubator.apache.org
>private-subscribe@spark.incubator.apache.org  -> This is moderated
>
>
>
>
>
>
>and
>only Sparks' committers, PPMC could subscribe to it.
>
>
>Hopefully we could start communicating using the dev@ list starting
>
>
>next
>week.
>
>
>For those new to ASF, welcome! =)
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>
>Henry
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 1:41 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J)
><chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
>Hi Everyone,
>
>Just to double check: does everyone have an Apache Individual
>Contributor License Agreement (ICLA) on file? If you don't please
>head over to:
>
>http://www.apache.org/licenses/icla.txt
>
>
>Please fill that out and then submit to
>
>
>secretary@apache.org <mailto:secretary@apache.org>
>
>I'll make sure that everyone's account gets created and that
>karma for the Git repo is set up based on that, working with
>infra. I or any of the other mentors can help with this too.
>
>Cheers,
>Chris
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: <Mattmann>, jpluser <chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
>Date: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 10:16 PM
>To: jpluser <chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
>Cc: Matt Massie <massie@cs.berkeley.edu>, Reynold Xin
><rxin@cs.berkeley.edu>, Matei Zaharia <matei@apache.org>, Ankur
>
>
>Dave
><ankurdave@gmail.com>, Tathagata Das <tdas@eecs.berkeley.edu>,
>
>
>Haoyuan
>Li
><haoyuan@cs.berkeley.edu>, Josh Rosen <joshrosen@cs.berkeley.edu>,
>
>
>Reynold
>Xin <rxin@cs.berkeley.edu>, Shivaram Venkataraman
><shivaram@eecs.berkeley.edu>, Mosharaf Chowdhury
><mosharaf@cs.berkeley.edu>, Charles Reiss
>
>
>
>
><charles@eecs.berkeley.edu
>,
>Andy Konwinski <andykonwinski@gmail.com>, Patrick Wendell
><pwendell@eecs.berkeley.edu>, Imran Rashid <imran@quantifind.com>,
>
>
>Ryan
>LeCompte <lecompte@gmail.com>, Ravi Pandya
>
>
><ravip@exchange.microsoft.com
>,
>Ram Sriharsha <harshars@yahoo-inc.com>, Robert Evans
><evans@yahoo-inc.com>, Mridul Muralidharan <mridulm@yahoo-inc.com>,
>
>
>Thomas
>Dudziak <tomdz@clearstorydata.com>, Mark Hamstra
><mark@clearstorydata.com>, Stephen Haberman
>
>
><stephen.haberman@gmail.com>,
>Jason Dai <jason.dai@intel.com>, Shane Huang
>
>
><shannie.huang@gmail.com>,
>Andrew xia <xiajunluan@gmail.com>, Nick Pentreath
><nick.pentreath@gmail.com>, Sean McNamara
>
>
><sean.mcnamara@webtrends.com>
>Subject: Apache Spark podling: Created!
>
>Hi Everyone,
>
>Until our mailing lists are created, will have to just reply all
>to this list :)
>
>Apache Spark (incubating) now is created! See:
>
>http://s.apache.org/yRh
>
>Yay! Thanks for the support in getting this started! I've gone
>ahead and filed the requisite INFRA tasks:
>
>https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-6417
>
>
>per:
>
>http://www.apache.org/dev/infra-contact#requesting-podling
>
>
>You can follow the bootstrap process at INFRA-6417, by
>putting yourself on the watch list for the issue. Now
>I'll work with infra@ to get everything set up in terms of
>mailing lists, etc, and then I'd appreciate everyone helping
>in terms of letting folks know to migrate on the existing
>email lists, and helping to work with me to get Git version
>history transferred over, and to start moving the project
>into the ASF.
>
>One other thing, Matei: it would be really nice to do a
>software grant on this:
>
>http://www.apache.org/licenses/software-grant.txt
>
>
>From maybe AMPLab (and anyone else). Can you help take
>the lead in getting that submitted to the Apache Secretary and
>CC me?
>
>Thanks guys! Progress :)
>
>Our first Incubator PMC report is due in July. I'll prod and
>help put it together. Until then, time to start transitioning
>and helping to get the project moved on over.
>
>Cheers,
>Chris
>
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>Senior Computer Scientist
>NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
>WWW:  http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
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