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From Koert Kuipers <>
Subject Re: Confusion SparkSQL DataFrame OrderBy followed by GroupBY
Date Fri, 04 Nov 2016 13:18:09 GMT
sure, but then my values are not sorted per key, right?

so a group by key with values sorted according to to some ordering is an
operation that can be done efficiently in a single shuffle without first
figuring out range boundaries. and it is needed for quite a few algos,
including Window and lots of timeseries stuff. but it seems there is no way
to express i want to do this yet (at least not in an efficient way).

which makes me wonder, what does Window do?

On Fri, Nov 4, 2016 at 12:59 AM, Michael Armbrust <>

> Thinking out loud is good :)
> You are right in that anytime you ask for a global ordering from Spark you
> will pay the cost of figuring out the range boundaries for partitions.  If
> you say orderBy, though, we aren't sure that you aren't expecting a
> global order.
> If you only want to make sure that items are colocated, it is cheaper to
> do a groupByKey followed by a flatMapGroups
> <>
> .
> On Thu, Nov 3, 2016 at 7:31 PM, Koert Kuipers <> wrote:
>> i guess i could sort by (hashcode(key), key, secondarySortColumn) and
>> then do mapPartitions?
>> sorry thinking out loud a bit here. ok i think that could work. thanks
>> On Thu, Nov 3, 2016 at 10:25 PM, Koert Kuipers <> wrote:
>>> thats an interesting thought about orderBy and mapPartitions. i guess i
>>> could emulate a groupBy with secondary sort using those two. however isn't
>>> using an orderBy expensive since it is a total sort? i mean a groupBy with
>>> secondary sort is also a total sort under the hood, but its on
>>> (hashCode(key), secondarySortColumn) which is easier to distribute and
>>> therefore can be implemented more efficiently.
>>> On Thu, Nov 3, 2016 at 8:59 PM, Michael Armbrust <
>>> > wrote:
>>>> It is still unclear to me why we should remember all these tricks (or
>>>>> add lots of extra little functions) when this elegantly can be expressed
>>>>> a reduce operation with a simple one line lamba function.
>>>> I think you can do that too.  KeyValueGroupedDataset has a
>>>> reduceGroups function.  This probably won't be as fast though because you
>>>> end up creating objects where as the version I gave will get codgened to
>>>> operate on binary data the whole way though.
>>>>> The same applies to these Window functions. I had to read it 3 times
>>>>> to understand what it all means. Maybe it makes sense for someone who
>>>>> been forced to use such limited tools in sql for many years but that's
>>>>> necessary what we should aim for. Why can I not just have the sortBy
>>>>> then an Iterator[X] => Iterator[Y] to express what I want to do?
>>>> We also have orderBy and mapPartitions.
>>>>> All these functions (rank etc.) can be trivially expressed in this,
>>>>> plus I can add other operations if needed, instead of being locked in
>>>>> this Window framework.
>>>>  I agree that window functions would probably not be my first choice
>>>> for many problems, but for people coming from SQL it was a very popular
>>>> feature.  My real goal is to give as many paradigms as possible in a single
>>>> unified framework.  Let people pick the right mode of expression for any
>>>> given job :)

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