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From "stf" <s.fr...@vierundsechzig.de>
Subject Re: App Design
Date Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:49:32 GMT
ok, the link is rather old, and maybe also a bit dogmatic: But most of it
still holds true. Apart from the usability-hassles described in the link, in
my experience you can add a bunch of problems you get when you try to
generate your frames programmatically (the simplest one being the
requirement to generate a link to the preceding "page"(whatever that means
when you use frames) that also had to work when javascript is deactivated -
the history.back() at last works halfway consistent for almost all browsers,
but it took them a while...) - then you have the problem with deep-links
into the site (you almost always end up with an xml-file that contains the
complete site-layout and from which you can generate right frameset - almost
always buggy and hard to maintain...), synching data in different frames
(using an equally bad mixture of javascript/sevlet-code...). There are some
applications out there which almost all have to something with configuration
(configuring a new car, a new pc and so on) which make heavy use of
javascript and  frames to maintain the state of the configuration: Although
i agree that there almost always a whole  lot of data flows from and to the
browser, which can/should be cached in frames, in reality these
configrurators almost always seem to be crashing short before purchasing
your new car, which took you about an hour to configure...

so, no, i don't see any real reason for using frames for other things than
doing some static designer-portfolio-pages (but i think they are currently
overusing flash for this purpose...)

ps: excuse me for this elaborate rage, but i have been burnt before in
projects where i was forced to use frames....

----- Original Message -----
From: "Keith" <keithbaconstruts@yahoo.com>
To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <struts-user@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: App Design


>
> Is there a good argument for using frames? It needs to be good, they
obviously
> are problematic to use.
> Beware the page linked to below is dated Dec. 1996 - most of what's in it
is
> obsolete!
>
> --- stf <s.frank@vierundsechzig.de> wrote:
> > frames suck: I don't think it's a good idea to separate your page-flow
onto
> > two different layers, one being the javscript/frame-constellation, the
other
> > the struts config-files. What exactly are you trying to achive? If you
just
> > want to reuse your navigation, then go for some kind of
template-engine(e.g.
> > tiles, even simple, maybe parametrized includes will be better than
> > frames..) - if you have a designer, who insists, that frames are more
> > "usable" or just look better, have him read this:
> > http://www.useit.com/alertbox/9612.html - it's already so old that i
> > thought, everybody knows it by now ;)
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <Mark_Glatzer@Instinet.com>
> > To: <struts-user@jakarta.apache.org>
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 9:10 PM
> > Subject: App Design
> >
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >              I am thinking of structuring an application as follows,
and
> > > would appreciate any advice and ideas of how to do this:
> > >
> > > There will be two frames.  First is a navigation frame where the user
> > > presses a button to determine the JSP that is loaded into the second
> > frame.
> > > Each possible JSP for the second frame will have form.  If a user is
> > > entering data into the form, and then presses a button on the
navigation
> > > frame to go to a different jsp/form,  I want to save the partially
entered
> > > form data from the page the user is leaving.  Then when the user goes
back
> > > to the first page they can continue where they left off.
> > >
> > > I have been prototyping an idea; the navigation frame uses JavaScript
to
> > > submit the form and redirect the old page to the new desired page.  So
far
> > > I have accomplished that when the form is submitted the action does
not
> > > really do anything, so the form data is saved in the bean.  But how do
I
> > > accomplish the redirect?
> > >
> > > Any ideas are greatly appreciated.
> > > Mark Glatzer
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
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