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From Aaron Longwell <listse...@newmedialogic.com>
Subject Re: [OT] MVC / Model 2 for Microsoft ???
Date Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:57:36 GMT
My jaw dropped when I read the headline on this page.... I haven't read 
the article yet.

 From our short discussion, I think my first theory was right:

"1) Naive to not notice that Java Enterprise developers are light-years

ahead of MS developers in terms of programming practices, design
patterns, and role separation?"

I have numerous friends who are dedicated Microsoft developers.... none 
of them have ever considered developing with SharpDevelop 
(http://www.icsharpcode.net/OpenSource/SD/Default.aspx).. and very few 
know or use online resources (mailing lists, forums, etc).

So here's my conclusion. MS Developers are interested in Best Practices 
techniques and many probably use an MVC-type design for their apps. They 
just don't talk about it. That brings me to the most compelling argument 
for using Java over .NET (and using Linux over Windows for that matter): 
The community of developers/admins/etc.

With Java, you don't need to spend millions to go visit TechNet 
conferences... you still can if your company is so inclined... but 
there's way more interaction happening online... Interaction that 
eventually turns into things like Model 2, Struts, etc.




Alen Ribic wrote:

>MVC and ASP.NET
>some resource.
>http://msdn.microsoft.com/architecture/patterns/ImpMVCinASP/default.aspx
>
>--Alen
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Aaron Longwell" <listservs@newmedialogic.com>
>To: "Struts-User" <struts-user@jakarta.apache.org>
>Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 7:09 AM
>Subject: [OT] MVC / Model 2 for Microsoft ???
>
>
>  
>
>>I hope I don't start a huge debate....
>>
>>with that intro, here goes.
>>
>>I am a freelance web developer. I've been struggling lately with not
>>being able to use the Struts framework on ALL projects. Specifically, I
>>do work with a number of Microsoft Devotees. For several sites, this has
>>meant developing in old ASP.... like playing with Duplos compared to
>>    
>>
>Struts.
>  
>
>>I have been spending some time learning the .NET framework. So far it
>>looks great... er, the features that look like Java look great. But
>>then, why wouldn't I just use the more open, polished,
>>community-oriented, original... Java? So now to the point... I don't
>>have a choice for some projects... I have to use .NET.
>>
>>I am curious if anyone is aware of an MVC-type framework for .NET. I am
>>NOT looking for a Struts port to .NET. I started doing a little
>>research, searching for things like "Best Practices"  or ".NET Patterns"
>>etc. I found almost nothing... no best practices guides. Not even a
>>single recommendation about builing Object-based backend systems. In
>>fact, most books I've read on ASP.NET and .NET in general have focused
>>on database access code directly in the ASPX page itself....(in the
>>"Code Behind" section).
>>
>>Am I:
>>
>>1) Naive to not notice that Java Enterprise developers are light-years
>>ahead of MS developers in terms of programming practices, design
>>patterns, and role separation?
>>
>>2) Mistaken? There really are MVC frameworks in .NET... but they are all
>>internal... and no community oriented projects exist.
>>
>>Thanks for the input.
>>
>>Aaron Longwell
>>
>>
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>>
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