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From "Steve Raeburn" <>
Subject RE: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Date Sat, 24 Apr 2004 21:03:21 GMT
Also, perhaps the question you should be asking is, "How can *I* help
speed things up?"

Here's a couple of ideas:

- Try out the Stuts 1.2.0 release and report back any problems, or
(hopefully) report how stable and reliable it is for your applications.
- Get the source code and try applying some of those patches that you've
seen on the bug reports. Let us know whether they work for you.

There *has* been a first 1.2.x release, it's just not considered
production quality so we're aiming for a 1.2.1 release that hopefully
will be. Ted & Martin, particularly, put a lot of effort into getting
that release out, so it's not like there's nothing going on here :-)

One of the misconceptions about supplying patches is that once a patch
has been submitted, that's the end of the job. However, a committer
still has to:
    1) understand the original bug report and be able to reproduce the
    2) apply the patch and *test* it for himself
this can be quite a lot of work, even if you the patch works as
advertised (not all do).

If you also go through that process and report back that it works for
you, the committers' confidence in the patch is increased. We still have
to do our own testing, but if your results match ours, then we can be
reasonably confident that the patch is good.

To address your points, specifically:

>> (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at a time and

I don't think that's uncommon in any software project. Some things get
fixed quickly because they're easy or urgent; others take a while. Only
recently, I noticed a bug for Mozilla that has been open for 4 *years*
:-) That doesn't mean Mozilla is a bad product or isn't being actively
developed, just that they had other priorities.

>> (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on these
bugs and

So only a few people are doing all the work? And you wonder why
everything isn't done immediately!

>> (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal at all

I don't agree with you on this (or maybe I misunderstand). Communication
on the Struts project seems to be very good, to me. We have an excellent
user list, an active developer list and lots of communication via
bugzilla. Don't forget that some discussion about open issues may move
from bugzilla to the dev list, or the user list. It's worth monitoring
dev, if you're interested in where things are going.

Lastly, don't forget that nobody gets paid to develop Struts. We all
have to work full-time jobs to make a living. Struts is what we do for
relaxation on the weekends :-)

Now everyone repeat after me, "The next version will be released 'When
It's Ready'" ;-)


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Riyad Kalla []
> Sent: April 24, 2004 12:10 PM
> To: Struts Users Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
> Niall Pemberton wrote:
> >Running a bugzilla query  against Struts 1.1 and the nightly with a
> >"Resolution" of "FIXED" shows 359 bugs - looks good to me :-)
> >
> >
> Ahh your query is a lot more impressive than mine ;)
> >and this bug:
> >
> >
> >
> >took 11 hours to get applied from being submitted!
> >
> >When  Struts 1 beta was released the servlet spec was 2.2.
> Since then (about
> >3 years I think) Servlet 2.3, Servlet 2.4 the JSTL and Java
> Server Faces
> >have all come along - in the next few years who knows what the best
> >technology will be to deploy - but it won't be the same as
> today (even if
> >its still Struts) and your going to have to continually
> re-invest in the new
> >stuff that comes along - all you can do today is decided
> whats the best
> >solution now.
> >
> >
> Yes this is certainly true. But I felt we were at an apex right now,
> between Old/New... JSF being the new golden child that I
> haven't really
> seen anyone use yet so we could figure out if it really was
> going to be
> "all that"... I was just curious. Thank you for the feedback.
> >Niall
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Riyad Kalla" <>
> >To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <>
> >Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:20 PM
> >Subject: Struts Development seems slow, info?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>Hey guys,
> >>I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a
> 1.2 release:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> NFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED
> &bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major
> &bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=sub
> string&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailr
> eporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfield
> from=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&s
> hort_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwor
> dssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywor
> ds=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&valu
> e0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
> >
> >
> >>and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to
> them, but I
> >>noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out
> for months at
> >>a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and
> over again on
> >>these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not
> very verbal
> >>at all (slow)....
> >>
> >>And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
> >>anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if
> there is waining
> >>interest in Struts and the devs are working on other
> things, or if the
> >>devs have always been this bad about communication?
> >>
> >>Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will
> be) but if
> >>Struts development support is slowing down and people are
> starting to
> >>look else where, I'd just like to know for
> future-time-investment sake.
> >>
> >>Thanks!
> >>Riyad
> >>
> >>------------------------------------------------------------
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
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