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From Thilo Goetz <twgo...@gmx.de>
Subject Re: maven build problem
Date Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:54:31 GMT


Jörn Kottmann wrote:
> Tong Fin wrote:
>> I really wonder if we're doing ourselves a favor by using
>>  
>>> maven for the eclipse plugin and eclipse update site builds.
>>> In eclipse we have all the tooling that we need at our
>>> disposal.  We could maintain the plugin dependencies in the
>>> manifest files, where they belong.
>>>
>>>     
>>
>> I completely agree with this concern.
>> It looks like we are over done in this area and trying to shoot a moving
>> target.
>>
>> For example, some time ago, some users have the problem to attach the
>> source
>> code with the plugin and there is no easy solution. Different versions of
>> Eclipse have different way to build the source code and the recently
>> released Eclipse 3.5 has a new way to build the "source" plug-in.
>> This is just one of the example that we have to deal with multiple
>> versions
>> of Eclipse and try to catch up what Eclipse can do with "maven".
>>
>> I feel that we and the users have more problems than the benefits
>> that  we
>> get by having a "single" tool "maven" to build everything.
> Yes but the eclipse headless build is even worse then what we have now.

I agree.  I tried to set up a headless build for a project
that I do at work, and I basically failed (it builds the
plugins, but something isn't right with the update site it
generates).  I gave up after a while.

What I actually meant was building the update site out of
eclipse, by pressing a button.  It's not command line, but
it's extremely easy to maintain.

If you and Marshall are happy to maintain the maven build,
fine with me.  What I don't like is that the build is so
complicated that nobody other than Marshall can maintain
it without turning it into a major research project.  I
have no idea if maven is to blame or who or what, all I
know is that I wasn't able to fix anything by myself.

I was hoping to work a bit on some of our UI tools, but
2 weeks passed before I even had a build where I could
run our eclipse tools from the within eclipse.  Now I'm
in a state where I could do that, but I have no idea how
to proceed if I actually wanted to make changes.  Normally,
if I wanted to add a plugin dependency, I would do that
in the manifest, using the eclipse tooling.  Takes about
15s, then it works.  In our setup, I have no idea what I
need to do, add some magic lines in a pom somewhere, then
some cryptic command line incantations, and if all goes
well, 5 min later I have a working workspace again.  If
this was all documented somewhere, I might even try my
hand at it.  As it's not documented, I'll stay away from
trying to improve our eclipse tooling.  I'm wondering
how many other potential eclipse developers (like Tong)
we're keeping away from contributing to our eclipse tools
with our maven build.  Sorry for the rant.

--Thilo

> The Cas Editor RCP version was built for 2.2.2 with the eclipse generated
> ant build scripts and it always broke when something changed a little.
> These eclipse build scripts are like a black box which magically transforms
> the source into the binaries, but if something goes wrong you don't get
> valuable
> error messages (or I was not smart enough to understand them).
> Since the maven build is now working better and better I think we should
> stay there.
> 
> Jörn

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