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From "Geir Magnusson Jr." <>
Subject Re: How do we win?
Date Tue, 17 Jul 2001 03:18:25 GMT
(Posting to list - responded to the CC on Brad's post...)

Brad Cox wrote:
> At 10:16 PM -0400 7/16/01, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
> >We haven't
> >heard about an NPE for a really long time now, and if we did, we'd fix
> >it in a heart beat.  I agree there is no excuse for an NPE. (I would be
> >surprised if every bit of code you write is NPE proof....)
> Last Friday, I wrote
> >  So I configured this line to read "file,class", which triggered the
> >  NullPointerException I mentioned. I didn't track it down any closer;
> >  the problem might be that I mispelled the class option, or the word
> >  "class" collided with Java somehow, or there was some other option I
> >  should have specified. Note the core problem: the lack of semantic
> >  validation of information from properties files.
> You responded:
> >Yep - that's what I thought you did :)  I know that one.  Will be fixed.

Ok - so if I fix it, you'll stop?

> Then in spite of repeated statements to the contrary:
> >I think the core problem is that you didn't read the docs.  Again,
> >section 10, "Configuring Resource Loaders" :
> >I really wish you would stop waving that one example around like a
> >flag...  just tell us what you did, and we will fix it.  Or you can fix
> >it and send the patch.
> I explained why I won't send patches before.

I don't remember.  Sorry.  I'll look it up.
> >I would prefer to dicuss your ideas in an open constructive forum.  You
> >didn't approach this community with 'open' or 'constructive' as far as I
> >can tell.  I am probably wrong as I can jump to conclusions (see that
> >bit about immaturity and insufferable arrogance...:), but that's how I
> When I was twenty-something I thought I knew everything too. One of
> the biggest lessons I learned since then is that it is not a virtue.

Actually, I felt the same way too.  Even a little later, into my late
twenties.  I'm my early thirties now (well, not very early, but I can
pretend...), which is only a few years of spread between now and late
twenties, I guess.

There's a point here?

> >read it.  And your responses only furthered that idea.  I saw the same
> >thing happen on tomcat-dev a while ago when  you brought JAWA up
> >there...
> That's why many of my comments are directed at jakarta as a whole,
> not just Velocity.

But why?  Why not offer an alternative implementation or a patch?  Show
people what you think?  The only downside is that it will be ignored....
> Speaking of reading dox, did you read

Not yet - too busy  with old Jonathan over there..

I tried to get through it earlier when you posted to the tomcat lists. 
I think I even responded to you, but heard nothing back.  I will

> >  >  Better yet, impugn their
> >>  professional capabilities, even call assholes, threaten to throw them
> >>  off the list for even questioning the developers' decision. And so
> >>  forth. If you don't know what I'm talking about, see recent traffic
> >>  on this list.
> >
> >I was a major cause of that recent traffic.  And I will note that it was
> >my professional capabilities, my maturity, my dedication that were all
> >questioned.  Not once did I resort to name calling or insults.
> The message was to Jon, not you.


Geir Magnusson Jr.                 
System and Software Consulting
Developing for the web?  See
You have a genius for suggesting things I've come a cropper with!

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