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From "Nathan Bubna" <>
Subject Re: A 1.5 release date?
Date Mon, 08 May 2006 04:24:56 GMT
On 5/7/06, Peter Harrison <> wrote:
> Will Glass-Husain wrote:
> >
> > We've discussed this on the list before.  My take -- Velocity is a
> > mature product, with a released version in use lots of places.  For 1.5
> > we focused on bug fixes (and improvements in error reporting,
> > integration, etc) and it's pretty stable.  There's really no important
> > bugs left that haven't been solved-- Look at JIRA and look at the wiki
> > -- there's only a handful of trivial (if subtle) syntax bugs left.
> > (there's an irritating problem with including macros in parsed files
> > too, but it's arguable whether that's a bug or design issue).
> It is interesting that key infrastructure such as Velocity suffers from
> a lack of resource. My feeling is that I would prefer to pay for
> Velocity if it meant that a key piece of development infrastructure
> would get more resource.
> This is quite common really - people have day jobs that come before
> their OSS projects. I am not saying take it closed source (obviously),
> just that developers/companies who use velocity could perhaps find go
> some way to funding its development.
> Velocity is mission critical for me - as is several other OSS projects.
> I can't necessarily contribute to them all in terms of code, as I am
> President of the New Zealand Open Source Society - so my free time is
> kinda sparse. However, I can make a business case for contributing to a
> project that is helping deliver end user software.

This is how i've found/made time to do 60-80% of the open source work
that i've done.  I'm a bit of a hacker and do take some interest in
these things, but primarily i'm here for practical  and, more often
than not, business purposes.

> > User support is pretty good -- the lists have far more activity than a
> > classic "dormant" project.  And developers are still around.  (Myself,
> > Nathan, Henning are often present on the lists).  The major frustration
> > continues to be release - understandably many users expect a released
> > version and we haven't delivered it in a timely manner.
>  From a commercial point of view it is unsettling when we see
> functionality like the set null issue remain in the released code base
> for years. I am on the lists, so I know there is activity and discussion
> going on; as you say, it the lack of a release since 1.4 that means
> visibility of progress is low. Even a beta 1.5 would be good.

hmm.  something i haven't really considered...  i may be able to find
a day or two in June to roll a beta release.  i haven't released the
core Velocity engine before, but it can't be too much harder than
VelocityTools, especially as a beta.

> >  Regardless of
> > this fact, there's many users using version 1.4 and some using
> > pre-release 1.5.  The software hasn't decayed, it's only gotten better.
> > I don't feel competitive.   Everyone has to make their own decisions
> > about whether and how to use Velocity.
> True. I'm a very keen supporter of Velocity, and I really do appreciate
> what the team on Velocity have done. I'm really just talking from a
> devils advocate point of view - that from a new users point of view
> having no release since 1.4 looks like its a dead project.
> > Like Nathan, I also feel bad about the lack of a release.  A week of
> > work and it would be done.  But when I have my entire year's salary
> > hanging onto the delivery of a consulting project in May and June, it's
> > hard to set that time aside.  The other committers also have significant
> > work and family committments.  (what's with all this family stuff,
> > anyway?)  I'm reluctant to say anything about timing in public, since
> > I've been wrong before.  But I'm betting that I'll have that week in the
> > summer - maybe when I go on vacation :-)
> I don't expect people doing this in their own time to be held to
> anything. I certainly don't expect anyone to feel bad about not having
> the time. Businesses need some certainty though - so perhaps we need a
> wider discussion about how we can allow people to commit some time
> financially speaking (aka find a sponsor who uses this technology).
> I know of a few off hand :)

ah, a few years ago this idea would've excited me, but i've since
added a house, wife, and kid to the picture.  freelance work doesn't
have the security/stability i want right now, and the rest of life
steals the time i'd need to do it on the side. :(

> Regards,
> Peter
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