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From Aleksander Slominski <>
Subject footprint, modularity, pluggability, and LEGO blocks ... [Re: REQ: modular, small footprint, client side only SOAP Java impl? [Re: Apache.WebServices.Next?]]
Date Sat, 01 Nov 2003 20:25:27 GMT
Anne Thomas Manes wrote:

> You might take a look at kSOAP -- it's a J2ME-based client.

hi Anne,

thanks for pointer (i know kSOAP author very well :-)).

it looks like kSOAP is absolutely the best if minimal footprint *and* 
J2ME functionality is required and it is open source!).

i was thinking more in direction of modularity and ability to compose 
desired functionality by pluggable modules (like LEGO ...) that are 
ready to use and compose (not just that framework is extensible) so if 
you want to use XML security or reliable messaging you just plug such 

however it seems that that to make this happen requires to think in such 
way from beginning and maintain very strict policy on not creating 
intermingled "spaghetti" of dependencies between modules. i wonder if 
you know anybody experimented with such approach?



> At 10:42 AM 10/30/2003, you wrote:
>> hi,
>> replying to Dims' "Apache.WebServices.Next" post i would like to look 
>> on more fundamental question concerning Apache WS modularity: i am 
>> interested to find out if there is any interest in very modular, low 
>> footprint, Java SOAP implementation that is based around XML Infoset 
>> object model with XPath support.
>> in AXIS requirements 
>> ( there is 
>> identified need for "*A single SUPER TINY .jar file must be enough 
>> for a client to communicate via SOAP*" but based on my recent (and 
>> limited!) experience with extracting functionality from AXIS this is 
>> very very difficult to do due to monolithic source tree (i do not 
>> mind to be proven wrong!).
>> i also think that on client side what is really required is just HTTP 
>> and doc/literal support, in other words to allow direct manipulation 
>> of XML, and there is no real need for sophisticated 
>> serialization/deserialization infrastructure.
>> i am very interested to learn about open source Java SOAP 
>> implementations that are in such space (modular, small footprint, 
>> client side only SOAP Java).
>> as proof of concept i have built Web XML Services Utility Library 
>> that currently has following modules:
>> * common (no dependencies except for XML pull parsing API - currently 
>> uses XPP3/XB1 for XML Infoset API)
>> * http_client (depends on common)
>> - provides basic HTTP 1.x client side support with simple HTTP 
>> connection manager
>> * http_server (depends on common)
>> - provide basic HTTP 1.x server side support with simplified 
>> Servlet-like API
>> * invoker (depends on http_client)
>> - allows simple invocation of service by sending XML on top of HTTP
>> * processor (depends on http_server)
>> - provides basic support for processing incoming XML over HTTP
>> * dsig_globus (depends on common and security jar file from lib/dsig*)
>> - provides XML digital signature and limited WS SEC support using 
>> Globus Toolkit 3 grid proxy certificates
>> (later: SOAP 1.1 Section 4 encoding (de)serialization support, small 
>> footprint WSDL, dynamic invocations using WSDL, WS-RM, and other 
>> modules)
>> client footprint for common + http_client + invoker is currently 40K 
>> jar (+ 70K for XPP3).
>> the previous version of this client side library is used in Xydra - 
>> An automatic form generator for Web Services 
>> ( and was tested for last 
>> few months so i am thinking about releasing it if there is enough 
>> interest. to give you idea how it works here is small code snippet 
>> (interfaces XmlElement, XmlDocument directly model XML Infoset 
>> Element and Document Information Items and are implemented by XPP3/XB1):
>> //construct XML
>> XmlPullBuilder builder = XmlPullBuilder.newInstance();
>> XmlElement request = builder.parseFragmentFromReader(
>> new StringReader("<getNode><path>hello</path></getNode>"));
>> // create XML service invoker
>> HttpDynamicInfosetInvoker invoker = new HttpDynamicInfosetInvoker();
>> invoker.setLocation("http://localhost:"+port);
>> // do actual invocation by wrapping message in SOAP 1.1 Envelope and 
>> sending it over HTTP
>> XmlDocument response = invoker.invokeSoap11(request);
>> String r = builder.serializeToString(response);
>> System.out.println("got back "+r);
>> so let me know about other open source Java SOAP implementations that 
>> are very modular and/or have good client side and i would like to 
>> hear if there is need for such library (i noticed some interest in 
>> axis-dev mailing list archives but i could not find any references to 
>> open source toolkit only mentioned were GLUE and Wingfoot both not 
>> under Apache-like licenses).
>> thanks,
>> alek
>> Davanum Srinivas wrote:
>>> Folks,
>>> Please review the latest proposals that we are working on. We can 
>>> have a VOTE next week to start
>>> the ball rolling for the following. As usual, feel free to sign up 
>>> for anything you are interested
>>> in.
>>> #1: WS-FX - umbrella for WS-* specification implementation
>>> #2: WSS4J - WS-Security Implementation under WS-FX
>>> #3: SANDESHA - WS-Reliability Implementation under WS-FX
>>> URL:

>>> Thanks,
>>> dims
>>> =====
>>> Davanum Srinivas -
>> -- 
>> If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough. 
>> —Mario Andretti

If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough. —Mario Andretti

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